Our poll this week brings up the seemingly more common subject: the future of Buick; specifically, whether the Tri-Shield brand should sell the three-door Astra GTC in North America. Some would say that the car would be right at home wearing the Buick badge while others (yours truly included) believe that the sporty three-door doesn’t fit in with Buick whatsoever and GM would be better off developing a three-door Cruze that it would sell on a global basis, instead.
So, how do you feel about the Astra GTC with a waterfall grille and a Tri-Shield emblem? Put your opinion to a voe in the poll below!
Note that we ask you this on the heels of our report from a few days ago stating that the Astra has been green-lit for North America.
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Comments
It should be in NA as Chevy Cruze (does’t belong in a Buick lineup).
Lex why do you think that ?
Because Buick should be a soft luxury car, and not a 16 year old’s pimp mobile.
Lol. Well – put!
Bring the Astra here, but not as a Buick. Make it a Cruze, leave it as the Opel Astra, re-open Pontiac, anything, but not a Buick. Why? Buick is still an “old folks” car brand in the eyes of the target audience of this car. Maybe there will be a time when that perception changes? Cars like the Regal GS will help, but it’s going to take time.
You need good cars in the lineup to make that transition. Yes, it takes time but it also takes cars. This is a good car to help facilitate the change. Bring it over as the “Buick Catalyst”.
Actually you might be right about the timing? If they announce this vehicle now, you might be able to actually buy one 18-24 months from now? Maybe?
I would like to see it here. A small luxury hatch would be a nice addition to the line-up for me. I would like to move up in quality but not really in footprint and this would be a good combination. I drove the GS and really enjoyed the dynamics I think it could be a fun drive!
It should come as a Opel sold at the Buick store.
This is why Pontiac should be still alive.
When is GM going to end Buick’s identity crisis, Is it going for sport or soft?
No kiddin’! I think they’re throwing anything and everything at it right now to see if it sticks, reaping any and all of the profits/revenue, and calling it a day. Maybe when they finish putting it all in the bank they’ll begin to consider the long-term value of the brand, because right now — especially with the sub-25K Verano and Astra — it’s a hodge-podge.
I think GM should bring the GTC as a Buick, because there is a possibility that it could compete against the Volvo C30 sports hatchback
Absolutely right: the C30 is the only competitor I see. Maybe the Mini Cooper as well? But do those really need competing with?
Yes. If there isn’t a GM vehicle that competes, that’s market share we’re missing. How about an AWD hot hatch?
True. That said, the C30 only sells 300-400 units nationwide right now. If anything, I’d rather see a full-size luxury sedan that sells for $50,000+ and makes a good profit on each unit while selling more than the C30. Or maybe the Astra will leave the C30 in the dust so far as sales go… we’ll see 🙂
They might as well compare to Volkswagen Golf GTI
Another possibilty is the Fiat 500, and the Chrysler Ypsilon…..
I think 500 is on spark’s territory.
Are you sure? What about the Abarth esseesse (SS)?
Didnt Saturn bring the Astra over here a few years ago ?
Yep, as a five and three door hatchback. In the second Transformers movie, the main characters are escaping one of the Decepticons in an Astra five door, the vehicle that gets sliced in half.
I actually drove one today. It’s not great.
I almost bought one, actually. 2010 Astra XR 3 door.
I have an idea create a new brand called Opel USA… “The German car you always wished you could drive.” Ha anyway, just bring it over man good grief, who cares what its sold as…
Alex likes this 🙂
I agree 🙂
Actually if done right, meaning not verbatim the Opel this could be a nice vehicle for Buick, Here is my thing, invest in some sheet metal modifications have a suicide door behind the driver for access to back seat. Make car unique and even more sexy…
If you are having a hard time seeing this as a Buick it is because you are thinking about the 1989 Century you or somebody older than you drove back in the day. Buick is reinventing itself remember, in other words it is a clean slate. I think Buick should throw stuff at the market to see what sticks, it is worth reinventing the brand if they have to make mistakes along the way. I find it hard to believe that using Opel’s along the way of reinvention would be a mistake. If in 10 years we are all driving smokin hot 2 door coups by Buick because Buick is the hotest car brand ever than haleluia…
I’m just a fan of brand consistency… purity as well, but purity doesn’t always pay as far as ROI is concerned.
My stance, in general, for firms: do one thing well. Do it very well. Heck, be the best at it. Or don’t do it.
Lexus, for instance, makes very good soft luxury cars. It tried to spice up its vehicles with the F line, and ended up effing it up (pun intended). No one buys F products. But for the most part, Lexus did and still does soft lux the best.
BMW does performance lux the best. Intel makes the best processors. Dell makes the best cheap computers/personal devices. Hyundai is well on its way of making the best affordable cars, even at $50,000, the Equus is a bargain compared to a $100,000 S-Class.
At the end of the day, each brand/company is known for one thing it does very well, or has done ver well, historically. If Buick is reinventing itself, what is that one thing that it will be known for? What’s its forté? I guess this all comes back to the question: what is Buick?
It bugs me that I don’t know the exact answer to this question. There’s a bunch of “middle ground” stance on the brand for GM execs, journalists, and marketing analysts… but they’re all saying something different.
The GTC would have made a great Pontiac.
I hate to be nostalgic, but the thought of a Pontiac lineup featuring models based around the Opel GTC and Insignia to go with the G8 and Solstice would have been a dynamite lineup and makes me sigh every time I think such things.
Totally agreed. And then Buick could do the “soft lux” thing without any kind of dilution.
On a side note, maybe we should have “Like” buttons on our comments…? Or maybe a vote up/down system?
Yes, like buttons!! I like it lol
Looks like we have some coding work to do! 🙂
Alex – agree 100% if I pulled up in a 86 BMW and you had a 2011 BMW, anyone would know that these were from the same brand. That level of consistency in design language and branding is remarkable and is exactly why BMW is the leader in there market. This is exactly what GM is missing in so many ways especially with Buick, GM needs to fine tune buick no question. Until then they need to figure out who is willing to purchase there cars so throwing rebadged Opels in the mix is a great idea for now, but not the long term…
Buick has come along way in a short time, just think a couple of years ago all they had were Lucernes and badly designed lacrosses.
Very well-put!
Manoli, Pontiac will forever be missed, its unbelievable its gone. We can only fantasize what could’ve been. Now we are stuck with trying to figure out what a tired old brand like Buick should be. You guys should do a poll asking if GM should bring back Pontiac.
What if Opel were to replace Pontiac globally?
That would be a good idea but except IF Opel does make it’s shore here then it has to be a afforadable sporty niche brand to differentiate Buick.
You’re right it would have to focus more on performance and affordability to keep a line between Buick AND Cadillac’s V range.
Yeah. It would need to be different in the way Opel is different from Caddy today. FWD-focused performance.
For instance, I never see Caddy with a Corsa-like vehicle. Or even something like the Astra GTC. But I’d be all for having some of those fine Opels here in the States. Opel could even compete with Audi’s FWD-based AWD performance approach and let Caddy take on BMW in RWD/RWD-based AWD. That would also fix them up in Europe and accomplish that upmarket goal they’ve been discussing.
But if they do bring to here should Opel make something that’s kinda like G8 to compete with say Charger??
I think that the Camaro competes pretty well with the Charger, it’s blown the Dodge away in every test. Besides, the Camaro doesn’t have a stupid chrome piece that screams “FUEL” on the side in case Cletus forgot what goes in that hole.
Gets back to the discusion a while back about starting out here with little boutique like stores, so corsas and astras would be decked out and compete with mini and fiat… no reason to bring over insignia at first… ha or sell previous gen Saturn aura as insignia here with some updated sheet metal, (no that’s stupid) just thinkin outside box…
The fact is Opel has a great selection of auto’s that belong in more than just European markets. Opel needs a team within GM researching possible intro to NA evaluating best vehicles for placement here, and maybe even a NA exclusive vehicle with German inspiration that Vic suggested. This really is a no brainer… Time 4 GM to explore all possibilitiies.
Opel/Holden dealerships all you get are decked out models…
But then I thought of it when the first G8 comes out, I’ve wonder why Pontiac never offer a touch screen nav considering people are paying around 30s to 40s for that car.
Sweet, a Opel based on next gen Camaro. The design could be a take on a retro Opel or a crazy futuristc street machine… Opel needs something crazy radical…
I wonder if something like that would “fit in” size-wise. I have a hunch that the upcoming Opel flagship will be similar to the LaCrosse… and if that’s the case, there’s no room (from a dimensional perspective) for something like a G8 or something Alpha-based. Unless it’s a gullwing-door-wielding crazy car. 🙂
Yes, crazy gull wing alpha platform, sweet…
Draw up the plans now…
I thought about something… BMW has its M division and Mercedes-Benz has its AMG divison. Why can’t Buick still be soft luxury AND still have a sports division? Like Cadillac has its V series.
Because Cadillac is inherently a performance luxury brand. With the exception of the SRX and Escalade (and the XTS, which in itself is a stop gap), Caddy is all about spirited driving in luxury. The current SRX should have been a Buick — and Caddy’s CUV lineup should mirror that of MBZ or BMW — with a focus on performance. The SRX doesn’t come close, unfortunately.
So, Caddy should do what it does best — or at least portray a unified image of doing just that — while allowing Buick to beat Lexus at its own game. The only reason for Lexus’ F line is because they need to appeal to as many buyers as possible with a single lux brand. GM has two lux brands and doesn’t need to sully one’s image in that way.
word
You just put another reason; Lexus’ F line would have also competed with Buick’s Super(just example) sport line.
Well, I see it as another reason NOT to do it. The core Lexus customer doesn’t even know how many cylinders their car’s engine has, let alone care about sporty this or super that. They just want a quiet and comfortable ride that’s isolating and homely, with a dose of “I’m rich” status sprinkled in. Lexus HAS to do a performance line because it doesn’t want to lose those customers to BMW, etc… but it is losing those buyers, since BMW does performance better all day long.
So while Lexus is chasing BMW and losing (badly) with the F line, it’s also alienating its core customers (the ones who don’t care about sport/performance).
The scenario I always bring up is: meet John. 55 years old, just bought Lexus’ best-selling sedan, the ES350. It’s a soft luxury vehicle. As soft as they get. It can be quick, but few push it.
To John, Lexus is a brand that’s all about comfort. He loves his ES because of this comfort and luxury… as well as the image of telling others that he proudly drives a Lexus. So imagine John’s surprise when he sees a blaring, roaring, and raucous ad about the IS-F… with its 500 horses and loud-ass exhaust note. All of a sudden, John feels abandoned and confused. The brand that he thought was all about comfort and luxury — the brand that he bought solely based on those qualities — has now changed. And he doesn’t like it. In fact, if he wanted performance (to hear the engine, exhaust note, and to be connected with the road, etc.), he would have purchased a BMW or Audi. Not a Lexus.
And while Lexus is out trying to be hip and cool and attract the BMW loyalists, the BMW faithful laugh and sneer at their efforts (as can be evidenced by sales of the IS-F vs. M3, C63 AMG, S4, etc.). So Lexus has done 2 things here:
1. They’ve alienated John, their core customer, and
2. They’ve failed (failing) to attract enough performance customers to make up for John’s dissatisfaction
It all comes down to Lexus having a split personality because they are a single luxury brand, and thus have to fend for themselves against BMW, Mercedes, Caddy, Buick, Acura, and the rest. GM has two brands in Caddy and Buick. Let one focus on spirited driving; let the other perfect the pure luxury experience and earn the perception crown in that segment.
Finally someone agrees with me! John can kiss my ass for not buying a Buick LaCrosse, and would not have to worry about Buick not being quiet and plush, because it is! I also realized that Buick is fine how it is, because I also have a scenario. Two short ones, to be exact.
Daniel wants a luxury car that isnt too expensive but still wants all the amenities of a much more expensive car. Why, he’s just found the Buick LaCrosse, which just focuses on what he wants. A plush, soft ride and uber luxury feel for under $40,000. Now, can the aging Lexus ES350 compare to that?
Josh also wants a luxury car, but also wants a sport sedan. Well theres the $33,595+ Lexus IS or the Buick Regal thats under $40,000 but also has the same luxuries at a cheaper price. What do you think he will get?
Question: “Can the aging Lexus ES350 compare to that?”
Answer: Yes. I owned one for two years. Aging or not, the ES is THE defining vehicle in its segment. The LaCrosse is good, but the “aging” ES is still better. And it’s a REAL luxury car, providing leather, keyless entry and push-button start, as well as auto-dimming mirrors, just to name a few, standard. The LaCrosee is supposed to be a luxury car… but it offers luxury as an option… which doesn’t make sense, since luxury should be standard in a luxury car. Right?
As for Josh, I’d recommend he get the upcoming ATS. It will do what the Regal does… and do it better. From what we hear, it will start around $30,000.
I think both examples further demonstrate that a brand should have a specific focus. In the case of Caddy, it should be sport luxury — right up Josh’s alley. As for Buick, it should be soft luxury — exactly what Daniel prefers.
However, soft luxury doesn’t necessarily mean Impala-like land yacht experience. A Buick should still be a well-rounded vehicle… but the focus changes from BMW’s (and hopefully Cadillac’s) performance (read: more audible exhaust note, stiffer suspension, enthusiast-tuned steering) to that of Lexus (and hopefully Buick), such as a more isolated cabin and a more relaxed (softer) ride.
Your right. Caddy should completely go Luxury Performance-Oriented and Buick can take care of the full-on luxury and give itself an edge and challenge to compete with.
So your answer to the original question on this string is “No”? I’m not disagreeing with you at all, I’m just curious where that leaves us.
They might as well. I mean look at the interior of the Verano and the GTC. They both look exactly the same. The GTC should be called the Verano GS, just like the Regal and its GS counterpart.
But then again the ES barely caught up with technology though. The last time the Lexus compare with Buick on Insideline Lexus still has cassette player.
I don’t think tech is very important in that segment. Like I said before, many Lexus buyers don’t know how many cylinders their car has or that the 350 means 3.5 liter. I’m betting that CDs are right up most Lexus Owners’ alleys. Not sure what year InsideLine’s ES us, but my 2010 didn’t have a tape deck…
Overall, the ES does what the LaCrosse does… But it does it better. The LaCrosse is newer and has better/more modern tech.
I think they did 09
Looks like we set a record on the # of posts…
61, wow. Bring the Astra GTC to the states, enough said… Make Buick a competitive luxury brand competing directly with Lexus. Got it GM…