Cadillac U.S. Sales Down 11.8 Percent To 12,580 Units In June 2017

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• Maybe GM should think about putting a V8 in the CT6. Capture some of the German car business!

  • And retain a few of us long time Cadillac buyers too.

• Lincoln is getting back it's roots and Cadillac is not....Cadillac should be as good as S-Class whale being the soft riding boulevard long distance cruisers like the Lincoln Continental.....the CT6 isn't it.

• CADILLAC SHOULD STOP LOOKING AHEAD AND STOP ADJUSTING ITS BRAND AND PRODUCT TO MEET FUTURE GROWTH MARKETS, AND JUST FOCUS ON ITS EXISTING CUSTOMER BASE!!!

  FIRE JOHAN DENOTHING AND BRING BACK DEVILLE AND FLEETWOOD BROUGHAM!!!

  GIVE IT A BENCH SEAT AND A COLUMN SHIFTER AND A FREE COUPON FOR AN EARLY BIRD SPECIAL!!! THOSE CUSTOMERS WILL BE ALIVE FOR AT LEAST FIVE MORE YEARS, SO JUST PURSUE SHORT TERM SALES AND FIGURE OUT THE REST LATER!!!

  Sorry, I thought that was the required sentiment when commenting on any Cadillac news.

  • I originally downvoted that mess, but I now know it's sarcasm.

    • It's obviously sarcasm, but it's a phony bit of trolling by NewQ. It presupposes that current Cadillac management actually knows what the market will be like in the future, and that they are successfully preparing for it. In reality, we see no evidence of that. No one is calling for Cadillac to make replicas of past vehicles or return to bench seats. NewQ is simply making a "straw man" caricature so that she can make those who feel Cadillac is headed in the wrong direction look silly.

      All we know is that Cadillac's traditional values of making roomy, reliable, comfortable riding, strongly powered, brashly but elegantly designed luxury cars has been abandoned, in favor of chasing BMW as a sports-luxury Euro-clone. And we also know that Cadillac has been trying to remake itself that way since 1981, and has failed at it, going from the number one luxury brand in the USA to number 5 and failing.

      We don't know what would happen if GM were to try to make modern Cadillacs which embraced the same values that made them number 1, and actually promoted them instead of being an also ran German wannabe. The change in naming conventions is just a symptom of how Cadillac has conceded leadership to the Germans, by taking away real names and copying their soulless letter and number combination. You can't out-German the Germans, but Cadillac management keeps trying anyway. The results are seen in the headline of this article.

      • Drew, that's the kicker. Sales continue to fall and there are endless posts as to how JdN and company are dong everything right. The apologists make one excuse after the other as to why sales continue to decline.

        Heaven help Cadillac if that crack team ever makes a mistake!

      • There's some truth to that. Many people have legitimately differing opinions on the direction of Cadillac, and not all of them are advocating a return to the old days per say.

        But it's also true there's almost always someone who wants a Cadillac to be just they way they were when they grew up, even though those days are long behind. They can't accept that times have changed, and Cadillac has to change with it.

        I think, at the top end at least, Cadillac should aspire to the S-Class, 7-Series, and maybe even Bentley and Rolls-Royce, in terms of targets to hit. Those certainly fit the bill of powerful, comfortable, and stylish luxury rides. Those cars (except for the Mulsanne and Phantom perhaps) are still thoroughly modern, without the pitch and wallow for which old American land yachts were known.

        The sport factor is a tricky play, since even BMWs are getting "softer" these days, to hear the purists tell it. But, I think you need that pedigree to be respected as a brand. That brand is what sells a car, even though the other primary factors are comfort and style. It's a very fine line to walk, and I'm interested to see how Johann and team do it. I for one agree with where they're taking the brand and its image. I want to see the interior quality and the next evolution in design elegance back it up.

  • Would love to see the Fleetwood Brougham come back to life

  • You're mad because you can't afford the cheapest Cadillac, huh?

    • Me? No, I have a new BMW 7-Series. I took hard look at the CT6, but its interior quality wasn't up to snuff for me. Plus the performance and features were too inferior. Manual rear sunshades and plastic buttons are too great of missteps in that segment.

      If anything, I think the opposite. Cadillac needs to RAISE (and justify) its prices. It can't be the bargain-bin version of anything else, it has to stand on its own merits and command a requisite price. In terms of chassis sophistication (very difficult), it has done that. Engines are okay, but need more refinement and power. Interior design is okay, but I need to see the next step in design, and quality of materials and fit and finish needs to go way up to demand those kinds of prices.

      As I've said before, many people (though not all) don't like the direction Cadillac is going because they got rid of the full-size $45K Deville (among other similar moves). That car was a trick. Old people thought they had finally "made it" because they could finally afford the big Cadillac, like they remembered from the old days. But in reality, the brand and the car had deteriorated to the point where they could afford it. The customer in this example hadn't come up, the product had come down.

      The further away Cadillac can get from this, the better. It needs to get back to being the car of CEOs for a reason. It needs to price people out, and justify that price. Get a Buick until you can afford a Cadillac. That's the way it used to be, so many people forget.

      The question of how to do that is what's at play here. Johann and team seem to think sporting pedigree and performance engineering sophistication is the way to do it. Others think going back to personal luxury status statements, but doing it the right way for modern times, is the best way to go. Personally, I think it's a very careful blend of the two, with a large dose of hard-to-define brand/image as well. That third bit is what's so hard to cook up. I like the way Johann and team are managing the brand/image part of it so far (except for the commercials, I like almost every other luxury car commercial better than Cadillac's). I'm withholding judgment until I see the execution of the sporting/luxury play fully executed on a vehicle from start to finish by Johann and team.

      I want to own a Cadillac. I want America to prove that it can equal or beat the rest of the world at the luxury game, especially the Germans, the British, and the Japanese (and increasingly, the Swedish). But I won't do it blindly, or say that trying to recreate the past will get them there.

  • I'll take two, please. Hold the early bird special coupons. Definitely send JDN back to Audi.

  • Can you make that a 60/40 bench seat? Thanks much!

  • "NewQ says:
    July 8, 2017 at 11:52 am
    CADILLAC SHOULD STOP LOOKING AHEAD AND STOP ADJUSTING ITS BRAND AND PRODUCT TO MEET FUTURE GROWTH MARKETS, AND JUST FOCUS ON ITS EXISTING CUSTOMER BASE!!!
    FIRE JOHAN DENOTHING AND BRING BACK DEVILLE AND FLEETWOOD BROUGHAM!!!
    GIVE IT A BENCH SEAT AND A COLUMN SHIFTER AND A FREE COUPON FOR AN EARLY BIRD SPECIAL!!! THOSE CUSTOMERS WILL BE ALIVE FOR AT LEAST FIVE MORE YEARS, SO JUST PURSUE SHORT TERM SALES AND FIGURE OUT THE REST LATER!!!
    Sorry, I thought that was the required sentiment when commenting on any Cadillac news."

    NewQ,

    This post is hilarious. I know you were cracking wise on some of us who enjoyed the traditional Cadillac for many years. As for the old folks car I'm not sure. In my 20's I was rolling Fleetwood Broughams. They were good cars in that day.

    The Johan doNothing is a scream! May I use that one? I'll give you proper credit.

    There is truth in humor or it wouldn't be funny. I laughed on and off all day today as this post crossed my mind. The irony is that if your proposed Cad were made in a limited edition it would most likely sell at a premium over MSRP.

    Put a big thirsty V-8 in that car and the other mature Cadillac buyers would have to push me down to get to the front of the line.

    Yesterday's Cadillacs are not the future. We all know that. They were good cars that people loved. Hope Cadillac finds it's way.

    Thanks again for this post. It was a lot of fun!

• I wonder where the CTS sales went? Just people waiting on the refresh?

  initially I thought it was because of the ct6 but the sales were there last year as well...

  Odd.

  • Difficult for the aging CTS to compete with the likes of the new 5-Series and E-Class. Sales will only decline further when the refreshed XTS hits dealer lots, a car that is priced the same as the CTS.

    My prediction: When the CT6 gets a refresh for 2019, which will include Escala design characteristics and that new 4.2L TT V8, it will replace the CTS altogether. It's already outselling it, despite being more expensive, and is priced very similarly to the 5-Series and E-Class, unlike the CTS. There's no business case to redesign or even refresh the the CTS, so enjoy it while you can! They'll kill the ATS, too. A CT4 will combine the ATS and CTS in terms of size and price, and perhaps be similar to the A5 Sportback and 4-Series Gran Coupe in size and price, and maybe even design (the Escala Concept is a 4-door coupe-like car with a hatch as well). A CT2 will compete with the A3 and CLA. A CT8 will directly take on the S-Class and 7-Series as early as MY2021. And don't assume they won't make a CT10! I think they will...

    I think they'll kill the XTS in 2020.

    The lineup and competition would look like this:

    CT2: Audi A3, Mercedes-Benz CLA-Class
    CT4: Audi A4/A5 Sportback, BMW 3-Series/4-Series Gran Coupe, Mercedes-Benz C-Class
    CT6: Audi A6, BMW 5-Series, Mercedes-Benz E-Class
    CT8: Audi A8, BMW 7-Series, Mercedes-Benz S-Class
    CT10: Bentley Flying Spur? Rolls-Royce Ghost? Bentley Mulsanne? Rolls-Royce Phantom?

    • I doubt if Cadi will ever compete with Bentley or Rolls but would love to see a luxurious Cadi to compete with the A8, 7-Series and the S550(soon to be an S560)

    • That's a good match-up lineup.

      Just two comments:

      1) no CUV/SUV matchups, and ...

      2) I wonder if it's healthy for Cadillac to define itself by virtue of what 'we' have like 'theirs' ... or by attempting to redefine small/medium/luxe/CUV categories.

      If I had the answer to 2, I'd offer it up. Without falling into 'it's like an A8, only cheaper' trap. I'd guess styling and performance will make a Cadillac and Cadillac. Along with impeccable quality (maybe?) a 4-yr warranty vs 3.
      (That could enhance resale value on a 3-yr lease).

      Sorry to keep revisiting Elmiraj, but a 'statement' car or two - up the cool factor of the Escalade - stuff you can get anywhere else; that wouldn't hurt.

      Anyway, I guess I'm suggesting 'stuff you can't get anywhere else' vs 'our version of something that already exists'. Sorry this is so long.

    • The CT6 is too big of a car to compete w/ the E Class, 5 Series, XF and etc. and there will be a successor for the CTS while the CT6 could move further upmarket w/ a possible LWB for the next gen. model.

      However, the supposed CT8 is not a traditional luxury sedan what Cadillac has stated several months ago. All we know, it could be something very close to the Escala with a 5 door hatchback with a shape of a sedan or a four door convertible.

      The jury is out of a Mercedes Maybach, Bentley and RR competitor though. Wishful thinking never hurts though.

      Also back to the CTS: There are several factors why the car is not selling, which I stated a while back on other threads, well compared to the E-Class and 5 Series. So, I suspect that sales of the car at this moment is adequate for the time being since it debut in '14. Personally, I think it is good considering that it does not have a coupe, wagon and convertible in its line-up. There are other worse selling models like the XF, GS, Q70 and Ghibli. Like the CTS, they do not have a coupe, wagon and convertible as well.

      Cadillac needs a junior executive type car, in the ATS, to compete against the 3 series, C-Class and etc. Your opinion of Cadillac killing it off is not supported and does not make much business sense for them to do so if attracting the younger buyer which is its mission in the first place.

      • it makes sense that the CT8 well be a 5-door lift back but Cadillac shouldn't abandon the upright squared off treditional roofline for a more rounded coupe like roofline.

    • Chris, why should Cadillac let the Europeans set each "class" of car and try to match them feature for feature, segment by segment? They'll always be late to the party, low volume and low profit, following the "we'll let them set the standards and then we'll join them" strategy.

      Cadillac became number one in US luxury sales, a title it held for many decades (until 1998), by being unique, not by being a me-too Euro-wannabe. Cadillac should go back to being a leader, building cars that no one else has, instead of a follower of segmentation set by others.

      • I sat in the new Cadillacs and they feel like cheap BMWs not only they look and feel cheap inside and out but there also too euro wannabe performance harsh rides and that shouldn't be in a Cadillac FLAGSHIP at all.....the CT6 is the current flagship and it falls short....they ether will have to make the next generation CT6 bigger and make it a true AMERICAN CADILLAC with Elmeraj styling OR have a CT8 above it.

  • CTS doesn't sell for the simple reason of backseat space. Going to the dealer and window browsing it's one of the first things you'll notice. It's a pretty slick car, but the backseat absolutely kills it. Nobody wants a small backseat Cadillac. The ATS sells because it's cheaper, and people who want a brand new Cadillac, just because it's a Cadillac, but don't want to pay a premium for brand, they'll go ATS. Otherwise the CTS loses out because of price point, backseat and people immediately go check out the XTS.

    All before even getting inside and test driving the cars.

    • Very true regarding the CTS! It is indeed a car that's larger on the outside than it is on the inside, which is unacceptable! I'll also add the huge price difference in comparison to the last gen CTS, which I recall sold quite well but competed in the compact sedan segment in terms of pricing. Not to mention the fact that there's far too much overlap in pricing with the bigger XTS (which most will likely choose over the CTS for that reason alone) and the CT6. As big of an improvement the current CTS is compared to the last model, its pricing is simply too much to justify, either over the German midsize sedan offerings or its own large sedan lineup!
      It'd make more sense to me if Cadillac were to simply merge the CTS and XTS into one large, roomy midsize sedan, and move the CT6 upmarket by making it larger and more advanced in terms of tech and features! Just have a 3 sedan lineup for the time being, since CUV/SUVs are dominating the market at the moment.....

      • All of you (Drew, Yoshiaki and J) are 100% right, the last gen. CTS sold VERY well, and it was in between the current ATS and CTS in terms of size, priced much more reasonably, had a good sized back seat compared to the overall size, and dare I say more comfortable.

        There is no reason why Cadillac has to conform to the German set "standards".

        If it were up to me...
        - the ATS would become a smaller, 2 seat coupe/convertible (similar to the XLR with ELR design cues).
        - the CTS would become more like its predecessor, in terms of size, price and comfort, and be available in a hybrid variation.
        - the XTS would be available in a 5 door hatchback, and wagon configuration with a V6, V8 and diesel.
        - all cars would come standard with LED headlights and Nav., no more RF tires (except the ATS).
        - all cars would have the reliability and safety of a Lexus.
        - Melody and Uwe would be gone, and there would be no more Cadillac House, or men's fashions shows, or free helicopter rides.

        • Henry, great ideas there. Cadillac should certainly not be letting the Germans create the "classes" with Cadillac merely attempting to match them feature for feature and spec for spec.

          - I like the thought of the ATS become a two seat "personal Cadillac". Instead of expanding that ridiculously small rear seat, might as well get rid of it altogether and give the folks in front some real Cadillac room.

          - Good thoughts on the CTS; I also would add they could bring back a wagon version. The wagon CTS-V is the only -V version Cadillac I like, very nice clean look, no gimmicky scoops or spoilers or extra bling chrome. Of course they'd have to advertise it this time, if they offer it again.,

          - I also love the idea of a liftback version of the XTS. Possibly making it the ONLY version of the XTS. It's silly that liftbacks are seen as cheap cars only in the USA, while embraced in Europe and Japan. Though the Tesla Model S and the Audi A7 may be helping to change that perception, along with the Cadillac Escala if they ever make it. And yes, a V8 for the XTS, at least in some version. I'd also recommend giving it an even more comfortable ride, go all luxury ride rather than trying to split any difference with a "sport sedan" ride.

          - Absolutely all Cadillacs with LED headlights (not halogen) minimum, maybe an HID option for those who prefer them to LED, but I think HID is on the way out, with LED taking over.

          - You'd keep run-flats on the ATS? I don't know, I hate the ride quality on those. I guess if this is seen as a convenience (no changing tire on the highway) that seems "luxury" but at some cost to the ride.

          - Lexus reliability, if only! It seems to me that reliability is virtually the entire reason Lexus outsells Cadillac in the USA by nearly 2/1 now. The question is, how to achieve that reliability at Cadillac. One way might be to bring in some people from Toyota/Lexus to point the way toward greater reliability. Cadillac currently has too many non-Americans in top management, and worse yet they are from the wrong backgrounds. I'd rather see Cadillac have some Americans in management positions, as well as bringing in some from Toyota/Lexus (for reliability) and China (who understand what Chinese buyers might want).

          - Uwe and Melody must go - YES! The whole experiment in exposing Cadillac to NYC "luxury" in order to make better cars was such a bone-head idea in the first place. Melody has to be the biggest joke in the auto business. Though again I have to give her credit for selling herself to GM, given her zero qualifications for the job, and for getting all those luxury/NYC perks for herself.

  • "I wonder where the CTS sales went? Just people waiting on the refresh?"

    We're lost. We were trying to make that lane change for out highway merge but that lawnmower motor couldn't cut it. We are half way to East Jesus Arkansas and may never find our way back.

    Thanks for asking. Didn't think customers were missed at Cadillac ;;)

• Well you need to consider Cadillac is not investing in the present product as they are one ducks.

  You are not going to fix much on these for the future and you just need to make them last from months to 2 years.

  The new money is going where none of have seen at his point and we need to let harm play it out and show us what they have been working on for the last 4-5 years and judge them on that.

  Investing in the present cars would be like buying an Ex girlfriend a engagement ring. Not a wise investment.

  The harts reality here is you can sell an older man a young mans car but you can not sell a young man an old mans car. The column shift and bench seat are dead and the automotive industry would bust a gut laughing at Cadillac as they are already struggling to lose this image. Only some out of touch with reality would attempt such a move.

  Fords hope with Lincoln is your discount their way to sales and that is fine if they want volume but limited profits.

  The way of the Luxury segment today is to tide the cars at low volume but high ATP and volume and high ATP with the SUV and CUV.

  While you may also want to note a V8 is coming to several cars like the CT6 but not a Chevy. Cadillac will once again have their own engine not a Chevy with a new plastic cover on it.

  To return to the past is a dire way of failure as how many years has GM played this card and nearly went bankrupt doing it.

  Cadillac today may sell less cars but makes more atp per unit sold and more overall profit. Expand the volume with all new well sorted profits and you will see major income even in a declining market.

  With what some of you want yo do they may as well just make electric scooters, wheelchairs and caskets if the want yo keep their old base.

  The present cars are close. The Chassis time and time again are rated best in class. But the details of interior quality and other systems have been lacking. The SS things will be fixed finally and we will see what hhr complete package will bring.

  Note none of this will happen overnight. Trust and desire of the customer needs to be earned. New compelling design and higher quality will over time help sell this. But one model and one year for a turnaround is not going yo hapoen, if you believe that I have a bridge to sell you in Brooklyn.

• Cadillac has been sending me an e-mail survey, "Your Opinion Drives Us".
  Being a regular mid western kind of guy, I couldn't finish it because I'm not close to the demographic they seem to be aiming at. More like the yacht club set. Maybe the brand will once again be known as "The Standard of the World" and I wish them success.

• the CT8 has been cancelled or delayed a few years and it's unlikely we will see a CT8 by 2020...I would like to see Cadillac actually compeat with the S-Class....or maybe the CT6 will transform into a CT8 in the 2dn generation as a larger and more luxurious car and get rid of the wimpy 4 banger.

  2016 CT6: from $54.000 Length 204 inches

  2025 CT6: from $85.000 Length 208 inches.

  Cadillacs needs to look like the Elmeraj.

  • Do you really know what they are doing or will offer?

    I can be safe to say no because none of us here know for sure what we are going to get.

    The facts. New do know is he Cadillac of your preference was one of failure. It is what led up to this point.

    We also have yet to see any of the JDN products yet. He may strike out or he may just hit it out of the park. We can judge once we see about 5 of his new products as to if this will work or not. Cadillac is not going to turn on just one car, one engine or one year.

    Time to let go of the notion of the show cars as they were just show cars. Even with the Elmeraj there is way more work to do as the one model is not going to save the brand.

    • what will save Cadillac ???....Cadillac need to fix there sedans, thay are tarnished at this point and I wounder what the next generation CT6 well be like, I wounder when Cadillac will abandon the A&S design theme for something Revolotionary and American like the Elmeraj and Ceil designs and I wounder whan Cadillac is going to STOP trying to be like BMW.

      • Cadillac needs to do two things fix the sedans and bring out a range of new CUV/SUV models. And what are they doing now? Just that.

        Why are the doing it now be cause JDN believes they are not good enough!

        They are not trying to be BNW they are just trying to match where the segment is today vs living in the past in a dead segment.

        Sorry but where you are at is not where the segment or the money is anymore. The world moved on.

        No matter the case you will never mistake a Cadillac for a BMW unlike how for so many years Lexus mimicked Benz.

• Cadillac has been trying to differentiate itself from others and one way to do this would be offering plug-in hybrid models for the fleet.

• I'll wait to give an opinion until the debut of XT4. Does JDN have it or not? That will be answered shortly.

• it makes me sick that everyone is going to sport- performance instead of true luxury....I hate the new 2018 Lexas LS, I think it's ugly as it looks like a larger Poarch Panemara or Testla Modal S....I really hate that thay are turning thare flagships into FOUR- DOOR COUPES for the sake of being sexy, flashy and sporty....JUST MAKES ME SICK.

  • Well, you can go blind if you like and don't have to worry about seeing anything again which will stop your posts for good.

    But seriously, looks in design is a matter of opinion. Your assessment of what you want from Cadillac is not reality and they are not going back, moving forward like you should but you refuse to do so, so you are hating on Cadillac because they are not listening to you.

    Like others said, no one knows for sure what the next gen. new or successor replacements will be like for Cadillac. I'm betting that Cadillac will succeed, which you on the other hand, want them to succeed but want them to go back to the 70s and 80s era.

    Ten years from now, we will look back and not imagine that Cadillac is what it is in 2027 that we did not think ten years ago. Do you seriously think what today's Cadillac will look like back in 2007?

    • by 2027...Cadillac won't tarnished as it is now....the current Caddys are just a watered down 10+ year old design well look different by than ....Im sure Cadillac designs...Im pretty sure A&S well be gone by 2027.