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Will GM allow the Mustang GT350 / GT500 and Challenger Hellcat to gain market share in the High Performance market or will GM release their ZL1 in Model Year 2016?
The past has shown that all three in the war typically wait to release their high performance variants by at least one year into a new generation. Will GM buck this trend now that the muscle car war is hotter than ever and their competitors are way ahead?
thoughts?
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The current (fifth-generation) ZL1 is a very good car, and it’s better than the Hellcat, despite having less power. The verdict is still out on the upcoming Mustang GT350/GT500… but chances are that the ZL1 will be just as good, despite being older.
Outside of that, there is no way that the ZL1 will reach the market as a 2016 MY vehicle. The “regular” sixth-gen 2016 Camaros (Turbo 4, V6, V8) will come first, then the uber-high-performance variants (ZL1, Z/28) will follow. Just how Ford is doing with the GT350/GT500 and what Dodge did with the Challenger Hellcat (which is way too late to the party and brings little else besides crazy stupid power that’s not very usable).
So, I predict that Chevy will actually not lose market share even with the competition having a newer (but not necessarily better) product. Remember, there’s always these things called incentives that can make an older product more attractive.
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Another GM purist speaking. Come on man. Dodge has shown GM and Ford the bar is set high with the debut of the fastest coupe and sedan in the world for under $61k. Car and Driver just finished the dyno on the new hellcat and the real world hp and torque were 722hp and 662 ft./torque. I own a vette and hit the drag strip with our club three times a year and have a blast. The new hellcat is awesome coming off the showroom floor with a 11.0 (Charger) and 11.2 in the qtr for the Challenger. Check out auto trader and see how many 2013-14 models of the ZL1 and GT500 are sitting collecting dust. Don’t get so comfortable about lambasting the new hellcat even to me as a vette owner and car guy. How many owners every hit the track anyway? GM was smart to price the new Z competitively at $80k for such an amazing sports car. I have my sights on the Z or hellcat or next gen Camaro ZL1 if the Lt4 is the power plant. I will sell my vette next year and order one on my list once I take a test drive.
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I suspect GM will wait a year or even two before introducing a ZL1 equipped with a slightly detuned LT4. It would be prudent to get some real world experience with the car on the new platform.
I believe a 440 hp+ version of the LT1 SS will give performance enthusiasts plenty of excitement off
the bat for 3 reasons. First, the Cadillac ATS twin turbo weighs in under 3,500 lbs so there is no reason for the new Camaro with an LT1 to weigh much more than say 3,600 lbs. That’s a full 300 lbs. less than the 5th gen SS. Second, even a detuned LT1 is going to churn out 450+ ft lbs of torque so we’re talking a gain of 30+ ft. lbs. over the 5th gen SS’s LS3. Finally, now with the 8 speed automatic transmission available (optional in the new Corvette Z06) maybe GM is finally done throwing a bone to the manual transmission fans by watering down the performance of the auto trans cars (gearing and final gear ratios) in an attempt to keep the performance even. -
@Rathmullan Agreed. The sixth-gen Camaro will be a significantly better car than the fifth-gen. But even so, the brief time period between the introduction and availability of the sixth-gen model won’t be a notable event when it comes to Camaro market share versus Mustang and Challenger.
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Dodge… lol. The Hell Cat is good for two things: massive burnouts and impressive numbers on paper. It’s not good for 1) driving, 2) putting that power to the ground, or 3) at actually being a fast car.
As we’ve found out in the race between the GT500, ZL1, and now the Hell Cat, power isn’t everything. And though some will be blinded by the power numbers and buy the overweight and under-performing Dodge, most don’t seem to be drinking the coolaid.
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Dodge is LOL at Mustang Camaro and Corvette. Your comment is LOL moment especially when Dodge RD created a world engine in the hellcat. I own a vette and next year will have it on the block and yes will order a 2016 hellcat for my last modern muscle car. I can understand how certain individuals bleed GM and I call you faithful loyalists to the end. I myself own 4 cars and all 4 from various brands. WHY? Car guy not a brand guy. Jay Leno said it best in gauging a true car person. Its takes a loyalist an hour to browse a car cruise that has 2000 cruise cars. The true person that enjoys all cars may go down one row in the entire day. Why?
If there is a car person out there that has the answer how about giving these loyalists the answer. -
Chris, I find your statements about the hellcat respectable as a t is your own opinion but unrealistic. A 4k plus lb car being able to run 11.2 on stock tires and a 10.8 on DRs very impressive. As for it not being able to put the power down those 1/4 numbers should show that it actually does indeed put the power down well considering it’s weight. It was alreafy recently discovered that it puts down 651rwhp and 606lb ft. On drive train loss numbers that equals to be close to 750 crank hp and upwards of 700ft lbs. The zl1 does the figure 8 in 24 seconds flat while the challenger does it In 24.7 seconds. The zl1 pulls 0.85g while the challenger also pulls 0.85g. I find that despite the weight the challenger holds compared to the zl1 that’s pretty impressive for such a big car. I am GM loyal but love and respect all cars. But the hellcat is a remarkable machine. It wouldn’t take very much effort to tweak the suspension to be just a track capable as the zl1. The zl1 is a fantastic car for sure but don’t put the hellcat on the top shelf so easily.
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I find it amusing how people like @Auto-Motive are so quick to make conclusions about others. How wouid you know if I’m a loyalist or a car guy? Maybe a combination of both!? The point is you don’t know. And you should stop jumping to conclusions.
Have fun in your overweight “modern” muscle car. I’ll best you lap time at any road course on any day in my “underpowered” ZL1.
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