EV Owners Increasingly Dissatisfied With Public Charging Stations, J.D. Power Study Shows
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While the electric vehicle market has been exponentially growing year in and year out, the public charging infrastructure has not been able to keep pace. As such, it appears as though EV owners are becoming increasingly unhappy with the existing charging framework.
According to a report from J.D. Power, overall customer satisfaction with Level 2 charging has declined 16 points on a year-over-year basis to 617 points out of 1,000. DC fast charging satisfaction reflected a similar ethos, falling 20 points to 654 in the same timeframe. In fact, satisfaction has declined in nearly every aspect of the J.D. Power study.
Level 2 Charging
DC Fast Charging
“The declining customer satisfaction scores for public charging should be concerning to automakers and, more broadly, to public charging stakeholders,” J.D. Power EV Practice Executive Director Brent Gruber stated in a prepared statement. “The availability of public charging stations is still a critical obstacle, but it isn’t the only one. EV owners continue to have issues with many aspects of public charging, as the cost and speed of charging and the availability of things to do while waiting for their vehicle to charge are the least satisfying aspects. At the same time, the reliability of public chargers continues to be a problem. The situation is stuck at a level where one of every five visits ends without charging, the majority of which are due to station outages.”
It’s worth noting that there were three key findings in this study, including:
- Satisfaction with charging speed declines
- Public chargers must be placed in appropriate locations
- Non-charge visits remain an issue, and results differ by geographic location
“The results of this year’s study should be very concerning to all those involved in the transition from gas-powered vehicles to electric vehicles,” Gruber added. “Although the majority of EV charging occurs at home, public charging needs to provide a much better experience across the board – not just for the users of today, but also to alleviate the concerns of skeptical future customers. A lot of work is under way to address these issues, but there is certainly much more work to be done.”
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So, this EV push is going as expected, lol.
Since I have no intention of buying an EV, this story is music to my ears.
we told you so. enjoy your toasters. now go buy an ev hummer.
I wonder how this would have compared100 years ago as gasoline engine vehicles were replacing horse drawn carriages ?
As cars became increasingly popular in the 20’s i ‘m sure there were not gas stations on every corner and those who were against ICE powered wagons would have said it isn’t an issue with horses as you could stop at many places and fuel up the team at the neatest stream or field !!
Obviously, not an accurate comparison. Big difference going from an animal pulling a wagon to self motivation with an engine.
An apt comparison except that gas stations of the time were just dependent on deliveries of fuel. The problem, here, is that delivering charging capability is determined by technology. Putting the gas in the tank was easy. Recharging batteries is not. All gas goes in the tank the same way. There is no connector standardization for electric charging (if the power grid is up to snuff).
You guys love this one but the reality is, an EV vs. ICE vs Horse vs. Car isn’t the same. The ICE vehicle does the same job as EV, but better and cheaper…the only thing EV has going for it is possibly appeasing magical sky god climate change, and the “fuel” to run it can be cheaper. At least for now. Subject to market fluctuations though.
The EV is some wild eye’d fanatical “the sky is falling scam” as to be expected. The average citizen CANNOT afford the taxation that cometh from this disaster. Electric vehicle rob Americans of freedom. They may fine in a skating Rink but you are so limited in where and when you can travel about it is unimagineable. Plus, the time involved in stopping and charging is grossly prohibitive as are rolling blackouts currently, even without electric vehicles in the mix.
While I don’t own an EV, I suspect that some EV owners feel just the opposite, that they have more freedom with their EV’s being less dependent on fossil fuels.
And that’s fine if they do. The issue is they feel the need to stop the rest of us from buying what we want.
If you’re talking about ICE vehicles who in the world is stopping people from buying them? That’s ridiculous!
Ridiculous? “The CARB rules call for zero emission vehicles and plug-in hybrids to be 35 percent of light duty sales in the 2026 model year, 68 percent in 2030, and 100 percent in 2035.”
Max are you a Russian troll? You sure sound like it.
I’m guessing less moving parts and less drivetrain maintenance but I don’t know for sure. Maybe someone with an EV will chime in on that.
Oh gee say it ain’t so.
Gee what a shocker 🙂 LOL
So all (or most) of these EV early adopters (who HAD to get one to impress the Joneses) will now trade for an ICE. And the glut of used EVs begins, adding to the glut of new EVs on dealer lots.
Hopefully, lots of heads will roll over this. Most CEOs as a matter of fact. And lots of others.
We have a charger at home, and it’s incredibly easy. As far as going back to ICE vehicle;
never. You have to own an EV to really appreciate the ownership. Yes, Electrify America
“needs work”, but I will “suffer” through the rare problems I’ve had. There are a lot of EV
“haters” out there. The only thing that’s constant, is change. It’s not always easy.
I have a 2018 VOLT. I have taken trips of 1000+ miles and covered most of them in one day.
Having a blend of ICE & EV is the best way to live, grow, and advance into a new Transporation era.
We cannot keep still. We must address climate change.
You have the best answer possible! Now, if manufacturers will wake up!
The climate has changed since the beginning of time. Stop drinking that Kool Aid because in 55 more years electric will become the Boogieman. There’s always an idea for a creative mind to make a buck at the expense of your livelyhood.
Thank you David! Love the VOLT! Why oh why did GM “kill it?” Trouble free, comfy, good looking. Great following, go figure.
“We” are not going to address climate change. Mother nature will take care of herself and out planet. What we cam address is local air quality which is better than it has been in over 60 years, water quality, pollution in the oceans, recycling and sustaining what works. Driving around an EV is not going to change the weather!
Joe Yoman :
An interesting FACTOID is that previously, before Canada Decided to burn down all their forests, that their formally Ungodly HUGE forests (everyone pretty much lives near their southern border due to its too cold everywhere else) is that those forests are so HUGE that they :
ABSORBED ALL MAN-MADE CO2 emissions from all of North America…
Now, we need the plant-food anyway. Whenever CO2 levels increase Deserts decrease in size and shrink inward.
So, since the amount of coal burned last year hit a record for human consumption. This year (2023) will break that record, since the big drought in China has reduced Hydro Electric production, to be made up by increasing Coal – much of it imported from elsewhere.
Climate EXPERT Glum Greta Thunberg said five years ago that humans will go extinct by 2023. Looks like China has saved the day by burning much more Coal.
“HOW DARE YOU !!!”
I planned on refueling my 3 plug in EV cars using Coal Powered electricity by the power plant down the street. Too Bad NY State won’t allow any coal any longer. Overnight, some tiny amount of power (1-3%) comes from Coal power purchased from Pennsylvania, but granted – even that has a ‘sell-by’ date stamped on it.
Let’s see …………… climate change ……………. the earth has slowly been getting warmer since the last ice age. I wonder if I buy an electric car if the ice cap will soon return over Indiana. But, what will I do with the car when the battery is shot and I can not afford to replace it? Darn …..
Another troll. This one named LeRoy.
As Mark Twain quipped:
” I’m all in favor of PROGRESS, ….
It’s CHANGE I don’t like !!!”
Here we go with the veiled threats about complying with the EV agenda.
You’re dreaming Beachy, all you anti EV rubes are going to be eating your posts in a few years. They are here to stay and your ICE boxes will be gone in 20 years. I’m willing to bet that none of you have ever driven one.
We drove them as children in the Carnival. That was back in the 1950’s. They are not up to speed by a long way to match the capabilty of the ice.
I drove an EV Ford van with the high ceiling. The sales people and service department said it was good for 300 miles. I got down the road a few miles and saw range- 118 miles. I called the dealership and they were amazed, then they started searching the net for chargers. I made it within 25 miles of the customer and started looking around a Toyota store for the plug. No signs, no nothing on several large buildings. Got out and asked. “Go look on that wall.” Found it, had to park diagonally to fit into spaces designed for smaller cars. The cable was draped across a sidewalk when in use. Went for a sandwich, returned in an hour and had only picked up two miles. No fast charge option here. Took off and made delivery to customer with 7 miles left. To his credit, he knew the real range when he ordered it.
Unfortunately, weeks later he was in a wreck and the insurance company is stumped. The body shops aren’t sure if they can fix it or maybe they don’t want to.
Signed,
Rube
JGinLA:
I think the EV Ford was listed at 160 miles… Your dealership must tested the vehicle on the same route Hugh Downs got a Ford Galaxy to get 19 mpg, driving downhill all the way… That is the only way to get 300 miles with a 160 mile vehicle.
If any amount of resistance (think Baseboard) heat is used that will cut the mileage in half. The ‘industry’ will standardize on cold-weather heat pumps since the battery draining cheap resistance heat will only perform acceptably in moderate climates where you only need a little of it.
I hope manufacturers have the smarts to continue producing some level of ICE vehicles. An Ev might be fine for around town , but until technology and infrastructure catches up someday, an ICE vehicle will be most people’s preference for long distance travel.
Richp, My sentiments exactly, very well said. If I am on a road trip of any long distance there is no way an EV would be practical considering the time it takes to charge and the necessary frequency of those stops . I really dont see EV’s replacing ICE vehicles, no matter how many advancements are made in charging stations.
EV is great for the daily commuter with a charger in their garage. On a longer trip, forget about it. As more and more EVs hit the road, but slow growth of chargers, you’re perfectly likely to need to fill up, and find 10 EVs lined up ahead of you, taking 20 minutes each, or worse, a broken charger.
For now, I’m for hybrid. Longer term, I’m waiting for hydrogen.
Good luck with the hydrogen. A 6000 psi tank of it sitting right behind your kids in the back seat. I’ve worked with hydrogen and I’d never have it in my car. You think EV fires 🔥 are bad, you haven’t seen anything.
Neither EVs nor hydrogen are suffucient alternatives to ICE vehicles. The best alternative is the synthetic fuels known as “carbon capture” fuels. Unlike EVs, synthetic fuels offer essentially zero carbon footprint. Toyota, GM, Ford, BMW, the Canadian government, and several non-automotive companies have announced combined totals in the billions of dollars in research and development. A few companies are already producing it on a small scale, and it can be scaled up. One example is the synthetic fuel plant recently opened in Chile by Porsche. To learn more, do an online search. The articles that engineer frank Markus has written about synthetic fuel in Motor Trend magazine are fascinating and a good basic introduction to the subject.
As Mark Twain quipped:
” I’m all in favor of PROGRESS, ….
It’s CHANGE I don’t like !!!”
Sorry – I have no idea why this double posted
I always thought EVs would make a good secondary car.
This article is a prime example of what happens when companies allow Government to dictate the products they produce and sell. The rush to cram EV’s down the consumer’s throat before there was a plan for nationwide charging stations is typical government shortsightedness. When will government learn to let the market decide what products consumers want?
I don’t feel that the government is cramming EV’s down my throat. It’s an option. It’s not an option that works out for me but it works for some. I have not received any communications or mandates from any level of government informing me that I must get an EV so we need to cut the drama. I don’t know what the ratio of EV’s to ICE vehicles but I don’t see ICE vehicles going away for decades! Someone mentioned hydrogen power in a previous post. That could be a viable option in the future and would certainly make the Saudi’s and much of the Middle East less relevant and that Region of the world less prone to wars, IMO.
Hank, with all due respect, the government is not telling you yet that you have to buy EV but that will come if green folks stay in control. What is clearly already happening is taxing you to subsidize EV’s at the stages of development, manufacturing and sales via rebates so you are paying for this whether you like it or not. And, the price of ICE vehicles continues to rise at an alarming rate and those huge profits are also subsidizing the EV business. Much more is happening in terms of natural resource development and allocation also that affects you and forces EV’s into the market. Please don’t anyone be naive ! And also note that some states are already raising the road use taxes to accommodate EV’s so ICE will be double taxed with fuel and highway use taxes
Hank, with all due respect, the government is not telling you yet that you have to buy EV but that will come if green folks stay in control. What is clearly already happening is taxing you to subsidize EV’s at the stages of development, manufacturing and sales via rebates so you are paying for this whether you like it or not. And, the price of ICE vehicles continues to rise at an alarming rate and those huge profits are also subsidizing the EV business. Much more is happening in terms of natural resource development and allocation also that affects you and forces EV’s into the market. Please don’t anyone be naive ! And, by the way, some states are already raising highway use taxes so to capture the EV road use and ICE vehicles will now be double taxed with road use and fuel taxes.
Hank, you are absolutely correct. The trolls, here, just like to stir up crap. They drank too much cool-aid.
So based on the of incomplete performance of internet service and weak cell phone coverage in some areas after 30 plus years of development, if car charging performance is just as haphazard then we are in for trouble. Some of us always seem to forget that most of our electricity still comes from carbon based sources and and windmills and solar panels can’t keep up and if all cars were EV we would be far short of electricity needs. Just think about how many gas stations are out there with multiple pumps at each one and then think about replacing them all with chargers. Much local charging would be done at home, of course, but when away from home the public chargers will be needed. Please don’t name call just because you disagree. Can’t we have civil discussions? Nuclear energy still seems to be the best.
The CARB rules call for zero emission vehicles and plug-in hybrids to be 35 percent of light duty sales in the 2026 model year, 68 percent in 2030, and 100 percent in 2035.
Could you define “cramming”?
A neighbor of mine told me that his son in law traded in a late model EV for a 10 year old petrol powered full size pickup mainly because of the poor public charging infrastructure to make long distance trips. Until the public charging infrastructure gets better, EV’s are best for very short distance trips and for owners with garages containing charging stations, and not for heavy duty hauling and in cold weather climates.
I really like my 3 plugin cars, but granted…. Public charging is a sick joke.
The local power company has installed a few dual port ChargePoints, but those units are unbelievably lousy – most of them are broken. The previous units were even more Gawd-Awful.
And although being an EVGO partner, the 2 year unlimited free charging is essentially useless with the Caddy Lyriq offer, since only ChargePoint fast chargers are around here and they won’t honor any free charging at them!
I recently completed a 1500 mile trip in a EV. I had no problem locating and using public DC fast chargers. Free EVGo was available in limited areas and I also came across some locations that had free DC fast charging. Yes, the trip took longer than in an ICE vehicle, probably about 2-3 hours. Driving in the EV was worth it.
Not had an issue using the Tesla superchargers on 300+mile trips. Should help as both GM and Ford have announced compatibility w Tesla charging standards beginning in 2025.
Like sitting and waiting at a Bus Stop. That is so rewarding. Lol 3 hrs is a long wait compared to enjoying the vast open countryside.
Wait! You can still enjoy the vast countryside with an EV. You just don’t leave a carbon trail in the process (ahhhh…)
You’ll use what you are told by big brother and get in line or else.
Your votes “DO” matter if you are capable of rational thought. Let THE “MARKET” decide what you drive, NOT a politrickster!!!
Those people get capaign contributions from the new game’s they create.
Fine with letting the market decide, but that means removing all oil and gas subsidies and start charging oil companies for the military costs of protecting their shipping lanes and oil pumps.
Raising gas taxes so that it actually covers the cost of road maintenance and repairs and the damage done to the environment and related healthcare costs to families due to increased rates of cancer and asthma from burning fossil fuels.
Well said. If all we did was replace ICE based transport for local driving and commuting w electric, non-polluting transportation we’d be going a very long ways to solving the climate crisis we are now facing. Not to mention telling the Saudis to go pound their sand.
LOL….
And while we’re at it, let’s make sure we remove all the subsidies on wind and solar generation. That’ll level the playing field.
Here In SoCal, the charging stations that are available can be costly, can be very busy at times, and cannot always “Supercharge” your visits plus you have to allow the time to do your required charging. Time is money, time is the one thing that we always can’t allow for in a busy hectic day, or so it seems for most of us. Driving an EV requires a different attitude, a difference in your daily routine, you have to “make time” while you’re charging up, and for some folks, that can work, whether it’s at their work place or if they work from home…but to most of us daily commuters, it is a time saving venture driving into “ANY” open for business gas station and filling up (yeah, I know petrol ain’t cheap here in SoCal, so what else is new) and within a few minutes you are back on the road again. For me, it’s that freedom to pull into a gas station, do what I need to do and be back out on the road again, but I suppose for those who can make the “EV Life” work for them (ahem) “more power to them”. Personally I’d prefer a true Hybrid, where I can choose again the time and place I want to have to stop at to “gas up” and then, maybe at home “charge up”…in other words, I still want the freedom to use my time I allot myself to do what I need to do without having to “plan a charge up place” within my daily routine. Just my opinion here, I’m sure there will be those EV owners who don’t agree and have “everything all planned for themselves every day”, and I say to you (once again) “more power to you”! ‘Nuff said.
There was a time when the only choice was a Horse or some other animal. We have millions of cars but the Horse wasn’t outlawed. Think about that.
Why? It’s not relevant.
Help us out with that comment Max. It doesn’t make any horse sense.
It makes perfect sense. When the gas powered car replaced the horse the government didn’t prevent the sales or use of horses for transportation correct? By implementing draconian emissions requirements and banning sales of ICE vehicles by a certain date that is outlawing the sales of any new gas powered vehicle. Sure you can still buy a used ICE but many want brand new and will have no other option by 2035. Let the market dictate what sells and not the politicians.
I don’t get it. Why do the anti-EV people feel the need to come on here and make this about anything but what it really is? And why do pro-EV people take the bait?
This is quite simple: It’s about the experience of charging the EV’s at public places and it needs to be compared to refueling at a gas station. Now I haven’t needed to do that (thankfully) since January, but my experiences at gas stations have not been stellar. Most are not clean, you are stepping in fuel spills, the pump handles are filthy, the card readers only seem to work half the time and then you must pay before you pump in most places. Depending on the time of day, if’s not unusual to have to wait in line for a pump and one can often spend 10 minutes just to get 200 to 300 miles of range.
Now compare to the charging stations. You still have people who treat the place like a personal garbage bin, you still have to grab the cord handles to plug in. You have to wait at time just to start charging. You have to deal with other idiot people at the chargers who think everyone else wants to listen to their choice of music. I could go on, but I think the similarities are all there.
The huge difference is that I DON”T NEED to go there. Even if I’m only using a 120 outlet, I have the option of charging from my garage! I’m the only one touching the cord/handle. No garbage and no spills and no rancid music from other people. I’m lucky to have a 240 level 2 in my garage that was FREE as most can get and the install was under $800. No matter, the public charging is growing and will need more regulations just like the gas stations already have. Very soon you will be able to pull up in your EV, plug in and be 80 to 90% charges in under 10 minutes with ranges from 200 to 500 miles. Doesn’t sound too much different from that dirty gas station!
Oh, look, an EV owner who thinks they’re better than the rest of the unwashed masses. Who would have thought?
I know I have been to some very sketchy gas stations. Thing is, it is a very short stay. Less than 5 minutes from pull in to pull out. For an EV, it will be minimum of 10, and more likely an hour. And then there is going to be the problem of wait time. There is. You are fooling yourself if you believe otherwise. I’ve been to gas station parks with 20 pumps with another park across the street with 20 pumps in the middle of nowhere. I had to wait a couple of cars to get to the pump, so over 120 cars between the two stations. The process is running at full speed with cars getting a fill in 5 minutes or less. Now take your case. Let’s assume your wildly unbelievable 10 minutes. SO it means a minimum of 2X the number of charge stations to replace or 80 level 3 chargers between the two stations in the middle of nowhere getting fed 200KW each. (16MW for those that don’t do math) I see a problem. And 200KW still takes 30 minutes to charge a 100KWh battery assuming zero losses in the charge. So now you need 40*6 charge station. 6 is because you need to replace a 5 minute gas pump fill time with a 30 minute 200KW EV charge time. So now your 16MW line becomes 48MW.
MkAtx:
Man that’s a hard review..
It’s even pretty hard on gas stations, which in my area, at least seem pretty well run.
You are correct that it only takes about 6 hp of submersible pumps to run 12 or more simultaneously running dispensers, filling more than 100 cars per hour if necessary.
Tesla’s experience here is illuminating. Although few of their stations will pass an electrical inspection, be that as it may, they are the most reliable of what is available for the public, all other brands being inexplicably so much worse in reliability.
They only have problems on holiday travel days when the cars back up. Sharing between cars slows things down somewhat but the power levels required are far less than you indicate.
On other than those problem scenarios most people charge overnight at home, which is very beneficial to electric grid longevity and efficiency. It’s those cars which have removed themselves from the refueling problem.
My new Lyriq is my first totally electric vehicle out of the eight i’ve had to have economical heat pump heating so necessary in very cold weather. I’ll have to wait for this winter to see the actual efficiency of the system.
Have never experienced any of the issues at gas stations your claiming. Fuel spills are extremely rare, the handles are fine and the majority of them keep them neat and orderly. It takes me less than 5 minutes to fill up and pay going inside as I avoid the busy stations in the middle of town. You must be living somewhere in California or Detroit to be experiencing those poor conditions!
Not mentioned and seldom reported … EVs suck in near zero temps of Winter. NOT for the Northern Climes .
There is a place for EV’s, just not at my house. Where I live, the police and fire departments are recommending that EV owners do not park their vehicles in the garage. We’ve had too many fires. I didn’t build a garage on my house to store anything but a car. I can only imagine how successful that strategy will be when it starts to snow this winter and the temps hover around 0 to -20. The range will be severely reduced and that ain’t all. As for the charging time, even a DC public charger is going to take 1 to 1 1/2 hours to charge. My 1500 crew cab diesel will go just a little over 700 miles on a tank of fuel and then I can stop and fill it in less than 10 minutes. Besides, the weight of the EV’s are absolutely killing the roads around here.
Hyrolr:
If you can afford the cost of Diesel to go 700 miles, more power to you.
I suspect many will continue to purchase oil and gasoline vehicles seeing as the much higher refueling expense is compensated for the extreme convenience of quick and rarely needed refueling.
I’m currently paying about $3.85-$4.05 per gallon for diesel, Bill. At 75mph I get just over 30 mpg. The gross cost of fuel for that run is between $88.00 and $92.00. That equates pretty favorably to the cost of public chargers around here. Besides, I’m paying for all the EV’s who drive without paying gas tax and are destroying the roads due to their excess weight. The average EV weighs more than my full size truck.
Hyrolr :
Haha you should do a video and have them do a commercial on your truck…… 75 mph at 30 mpg, is amazing… Of course the heat content of diesel is 140,000 BTU/Gallon vs ethanoled gasoline at 115,000 BTU/Gallon. Myself, I have never had an economy gasoline vehicle that would do 30 mpg @ 75 mph, but perhaps a Prius will do that.
Cost of Diesel around here dropped from $6 to around $4.60/gallon lately – so I hope truck drivers enjoy the ultra low prices while it lasts. Of course, oil and filter changes every 5th fill up enormously increases the cost per mile (at 3,500 mile intervals).
Public Fast Chargers are typically triple the cost of charging at home, where at least 80% (4 out of 5) charges occur. People must spend more during vacation trips, but that is a small minority of their driving.
Bill, there are two identical trucks to mine near me. One belongs to a neighbor and the other is my Son’s. All three of them get in excess of 30 mpg on the highway. My son tows a 6,000 pound travel trailer and averages 21-23 when towing. Yes, it costs about double to change the oil if it includes the fuel filters but only an additional 50% if just an oil change. I admit that I pay more in routine maintenance than a gas model but most gas pickups I’ve seen are lucky if they can make 20 mpg on the highway and they certainly can’t come close to 30 unloaded. We make a lot of trips across I-80 in NE and that’s where my truck shines. I will likely never drive an EV, partially because I just don’t want one and partially because it’s not unusual for me to drive 500-700 miles for work in a day. It’s hard enough to put in a 14-16 hour day when those days come but I can not imagine what it would be like to try and find a public charge in the middle of nowhere Nebraska and have to sit in line to charge up. It would be a 25 hour day.
As I say – some people absolutely need Diesel machinery – especially on the farm with all the labor-saving machinery used there.
Battery technology is not up to the point where a 700 mile commute is remotely possible as of yet..
Toyota supposedly is working on solid state batteries that have double the capacity – if so my Lyriq equipped with a battery 10 to 20 years in the future might eek out 700 miles, as it will consistently do 350 in spring and fall seasons.
But that is not now…
As I say, people who want to eliminate ALL internal combustion engines just do not understand how the world works..
And a modern society needs refineries for the chemical industry, and other more esoteric products like resins… But one thing that has always been true is that gasoline is the product of about half the output from a cracking tower….
Prior to Henry Ford, and his mass – produced model ‘T’, the formerly useless gasoline was either buried or dumped in the river… Certainly it is more environmentally responsible to cleanly burn the fuel in cars and trucks than doing something like that again..
While my gasoline usage has decreased 20 fold personally ( I have one of my vehicles a plug-in hybrid with a seldom running engine), that doesn’t mean that in general, ICE usage should be decreased to this extent in general. EVs will always be somewhat of a niche player in the marketplace.
At a high cost. When a EV uses electricity, it comes from multiple sources, and saves the oil for lubricating an ICE motor. Less oil changes, less filters, less air filters. It all adds up.
Public attitude, culture, and opinion will change. We cannot keep using limited resources and not pay the price in the future.
The Ev’s and windmills have to be lubricated also.