Here’s What Happened To The Very Last Pontiac Ever Built
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Pontiac, originally intended to slot between Chevy and Oldsmobile, has quite the storied history. The brand is particularly known for kickstarting the muscle car era with the introduction of the 1964 GTO, and for soldiering through the malaise era with the Firebird Trans Am models.
1967 Pontiac GTO Ram Air Convertible
Around the turn of the 20th century, Pontiac was posting poor sales as GM struggled to find a successful identity for the brand, becoming increasingly stagnant and diluted within GM’s portfolio. In the mid-2000s, Pontiac started to turn a corner and find its stride with the introduction of performance models like the 2004 GTO and 2009 G8 GXP. In fact, it was later reveled that Pontiac was intended to become GM’s performance brand during this renaissance, similar to what Dodge has become today.
Pontiac G8
Unfortunately, GM’s Chapter 11 bankruptcy in 2009 and subsequent government bailout forced the Detroit-based automaker to axe the brand entirely. The feds wanted GM to remove brands from its lineup and only keep one the ones that were necessary. As such, Cadillac was kept as the luxury division, Chevy was kept as the volume division, Buick was kept for interests in international markets (China), and GMC was kept because it was profitable. This left Pontiac, along with Hummer, Saab and Saturn, as the odd men brands out, spelling Pontiac’s discontinuation in 2010. Interestingly, the last car produced to ever bear the iconic red badge was a 2010 Pontiac G6.
The last Pontiac G6
The G6 in question carried a VIN of 1G2ZA5EB5A4166962, and was equipped with a 2.4 L VVT DOHC four-cylinder engine. Sadly configured as a fleet vehicle, it was painted in Summit White and furnished with an Ebony interior. Even more sad is that the car experienced a relatively short life.
According to a thread on Reddit, the last mileage report to GM had the car around 60,000 miles. Then, two years later on September 1st, 2015, it was allegedly totaled and received a branded title. GM then voided all open warranties on the car, thus ending the G6’s record.
The last Pontiac ever built, this 2010 G6 in Summit White paint, was totaled and received a branded title
For a brand as iconic Pontiac, it’s downright tragic to read this story. Just as the brand came to an abrupt and unexpected end, so too did the last vehicle it ever produced.
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Pontiacs end was ” abrupt and unexpected”?
Hardly. The much ballyhoed G8 had to be discounted heavily to find buyers. A profit killing situation on an expensive to build and import product. Over half the production of the other models were going to Hertz, Avis, etc.
I had 3 new Pontiacs, an 84 Fiero, 02 Grand Am, and a 09 G-6. All great cars and I still have the G-6 and my daughter still has her 07 Solstice.
Nice woke move on marking out “MENS” in this otherwise great article.🤨
Guess what, George: those are vehicles, not people. It’s a simple turn-of-phrase. Fascinating that you were so threatened by it you felt the need to call it out, though. SMDH.
SMDH: I find it hilarious that George even brings that up. I read the entire article and that isn’t close to anything I’d think when reading it. Maybe some people like George are just too quick to label something as silly as that in the “woke” department.
To be fair. The visible strike out was silly. But so is the “anti-woke” vitriol . We all need to stop being offended by ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING.
Not threatened. Just pointing out how ridiculous this world has become. GET A LIFE
And now there worth the same as they were new, except after twelve years absent from the market the selection is very slim.
It’s amazing how GM have made so many changes over the years and allowed Ford to take them over.
The G8 was built in Australia. There it is the Holden HSV.
The Holden SS Ute that was meant to come to the states in Jan 09. Branded El Camino.
These were really something.
GM closed it’s doors in Australia in 2017.
It was bound to happen. Australia is a small market. Its labor isn’t cheap. Too bad: Holden, Ford, and Chrysler made some sweet vehicles over the years.
Ford has not overtaken them. GM is the larger company and sells more vehicles both in the US and globally.
I have a 2010 Pontiac Vibe. It has 381,772 miles. Runs great. The only thing I had replaced was the starter, alternator and the belt. (Battery and brakes). It still looks great everywhere but the hood. The hood has a bunch of chips of paint from stones.
Have a 2005 Pontiac Vibe (has a 2 year old new paint job) and 224,562 miles on it and it still runs great! I am the original owner. Aside from typical upkeep (new tires, oil changes, battery-on the second one since 2004!) I have spent $2000 in repairs since I first purchased in November 2004. Most people can’t believe it is as old as it is because it’s still in great shape inside and out. Great car…Glad to know that I can possibly get another 100k out of it!
Had a beloved ‘05 Vibe as well. But this car isn’t a Pontiac & doesn’t represent Pontiac. Vibes were all re-badged Matrix’ carrying the basic bulletproof Toyota 1.8 that also powered the 2003+ Corollas. They were assembled at the CA NUNMI plant which was a long-shared GM/Toyota enterprise that dates back to the mid-80s Novas, which had the nickname “the Corolla with a bow tie.” But the take-away: Matrixes named “Vibes” are incredibly great reliability champs with basic maintenance and affordable parts. I’d seek a lower mileage one even today.
The NUMMi assembly plant is now back in operation making Teslas. It’s where Elon Musk took the big leap from small time producer to mass production with the Model S.
Brad: That is true, but you don’t mention the fact that back in the day, the Vibe was rated higher than the Matrix by CR and others. It’s been a long time, but I read about this years ago and found it quite interesting. Pontian (GM) put the Vibe through more testing and was more strict on certain things. I wish I could recall it better, but those extra steps and changes GM made were effective and worked.
The vibe also carried a better warranty
Yeah, it didn’t have anything to do with GM cutting something like a Billion dollars from its marketing budget in that period, did it? Frankly I’m surprised you forgot to take a stab at unions while you were at it. SMDH.
Sad. You’d at least think GM would want to build something really special as the last Pontiac ever and then place it in a museum. But then again, as the article states, Pontiac was done due to the GM’s chapter 8. Thus maybe it would have been a bad choice to put one in a museum.
I think some of the comments are very sad to read because PONTIACS are still great CARS.
The most recently built Pontiacs such as the G6, G8 and all with a Holden base also have a great history!
What amazes me here about this G6 is that GM has no interest in at least restoring the last G6 built since any salvage car can be repaired – and this one is PONTIAC G6 HISTORY. But unfortunately we also know that GM executives are sometimes technically and historically unfamiliar with the GM oldies!
Good that there are still private fans!
Pontiac died long ago. The cars at the end were just restyled Chevy models and not even the best versions of those.
The G6 was a mess. It was from the performance division but they really had no real performance mode.
The GXP was All Spoiler and no engine. The V6 was just the standard V6 in any GM car. They had the 2.0 Turbo that could have been used but never did.
To be honest there is little interest in this case as there was in the last Olds. Closing lines today most cars are just fleet cars to use up remaining parts.
In history very few last cars are saved of any brand or model outside a C model corvette going to a new platform.
The last 10 years of Pontiac was years of decline. We did get a few models via Lutz but it was too late by the time he arrived.
GM never understood they needed the divisions to work together not against each other. Chevy had more say as they sold more cars than Pontiac. Too often Chevy prevented Pontiac from getting what they needed.
Delorean in the 60’s put together a group of rebellious engineers that broke rules. They did things well in advance of other brands but John was sent to Chevy to die.
These engineers still broke rules up till the Fiero and most retired. After that Pontiac just became another corporate brand.
While they did more exciting versions than Chevy they just never had their independents again.
Chevy got a Cobalt SS and Pontiac was refused. Turbo G5, this is a great example of how Pontiac died.
Todays SUV market would never have fit a Pontiac either. It was never a CUV or SUV brand. Also the few performance versions of these models today are over priced and sell few in numbers.
I am a life long Pontiac fan and have owned or driven many of their greatest cars. That is why I said they died long before this G6.
I am far from alone as at the Pontiac events most there will agree.
Imagine a 4th Gen Pontiac with a high torque Pontiac engine to set it apparat from a Camaro. A 1986 2+2 with a real Pontiac fuel injected engine over a 305 non HO.
A Grand Prix that was RWD or AWD vs FWD.
So much was left on the table.
Your article is well written, but whether a brand is recognized as an SUV or CUV or SAV by customers and the media is not necessarily a manufacturer’s job.
A manufacturer brings a model onto the market and if the media likes it, it is reported positively or negatively.
Take a look at Porsche! Who would have thought that Porsche, apart from the 356, 901, 911, 924, 944, 968, 928, are actually so similar to sports cars. Now PORSCHE has become an SUV, CUV and SAV brand. This also applies to Mercedes-Benz, Audi, BMW and all the companies we know. The market decides whether a product is popular! Unfortunately, too often the media and politics – see PHEV vehicles.
Conclusion:
Anyone looking for the market will find it if marketing and the media want it, then the CUSTOMER will also buy!
This would have worked for PONTIAC, but damsl the state didn’t want Pontiac anymore either – topic Chapter 11…
Porsche needed volume models and the platforms from VW gave them volume. Pontiac had volume and they already had HMC in most dealers as well Buick.
To be honest Pontiac was originally set to close in the 80’s. What saved them was the Fiero and Trans Am brought many into the dealers and people started to buy the Grand Am. Olds loss of the RWD Cutlass killed sales and moved the bubble to Olds.
Even as a Pontiac enthusiast and owner I can clearly see there was no advantage to Pontiac today, most companies are one maybe two divisions.
GM would easily be Chevy and Cadillac if not for Chinas love of Buick.
Chevy can do today anything Pontiac could have done and at a much lower cost and higher profit.
The days of a division for everyone are gone. This is why Pontiac, Plymouth, Mercury and others are all gone. Economics today force doing more with less.
Pontiac could have lived on but it would meet a higher price point if you did it right and it would have struggles with the public decline in performance.
Now with the Economy crashing GM will be in better shape being a leaner company right now.
Simetimes companies have to step back to move forward.
I mostly agree: the Aztek was a disaster despite its great “utility,” pun intended. The Torrent was badge engineering at its most classic: I know a couple who own one with Pontiac on the grille and a bowtie on the hatch door. Guess they weren’t paying attention that day.
If Porsche and Mazda can sell CUVs, so could Pontiac. I wouldn’t buy one, but I’ll bet someone would.
Exactly Pontiac would have just had rebadged vehicles as a SUV. They really would never have gotten the engines they needed.
Porsche SUV models are just rebadged VW models but at least they get special attention. Chevy would never let Pontiac get the upper hand. They would have the same 3.6 my Acadia has.
Speaking of GMC you want an example of the Pontiac SUV. Look at the Terrain. When Pontiac was killed the Terrain was a Torrent Pontiac. The changed very little on it. Even the dash had the red Pontiac light as a GMC.
The only thing Pontiac had coming in the non car segment that was interesting was the G8 sport truck. But at near $45,000 at that time they expected less than 10k to be sold per year.
The market has left what Pontiac was. The Mustang and Camaro sales are in decline. The Mopars sell a bit better per the lower cost but even their numbers are down. Pontiac used to sell as many GTOs in one year as all the Dodge, Ford and Camaros sold in one year now.
Trucks and Jeeps are where it is at and I still hope GMC or Chevybwould do a Jeep like vehicle. The Bronco is still not up to the Jeep and for better or worse the Jeep is stuck with a look.
The first gen Acadia spent alot of its development as a future Pontiac.
Actually It was a production Saturn then became a GMC after Saturn was shut down.
The real question is why someone would buy that SUV with Pontiac on the front, and Chevy on the back. Didn’t the buyer think to look that SUV over before buying it? And why buy it if you think it is suspect in quality?
The real question is why someone would buy that SUV with Pontiac on the front and Chevy on the back. Didn’t the buyer think to look that SUV over before buying it? And why buy it if you think it is suspect in quality?
They got a good price.
Nothing new on the Emblem mix up. I have seen it on Ford, Chrysler, and Toyota.
I knew a woman who bought a Ford Fairmont with a Mercury Zephyr front clip. She called it a “Ford Mercury.”
Bologna! It’s not 1973 anymore… Clearly you’ve never set foot in modern assembly plant. “I guess they weren’t paying attention that day” doesn’t happen with something as blatantly obvious as the badge on the car. If the badges would even fit interchangeably (the probably won’t), there’s no way it would make it past quality control at the plant, delivery center, or Dealership… Your “friends” either are or bought used cars from idiot rednecks that were too cheap to replace collision damaged vehicles with the correct parts. Either that or you’re completely full of it…
The last issue I saw was not long ago. The web has photos of mistakes like emblems.
Now I would agree mixed front clips don’t happen.
One big one now is the screen lights up with Chevy in a GMC etc. seen several of these.
I work at a Chevy dealership, and I went and sat in one of our new Traverse’s just to see what it was equipped with.
When I booted it up, the infotainment booted as Cadillacs “cue” system and I laughed my ass off. The Traverse just downgraded itself right in front of me!
While showing off classic Pontiacs at our local Pontiac/ GMC dealer, I spotted a brand new GMC pickup that was Chevy on one side and GMC on the other. I should have bought it but I had a new Ford work truck at home and not enough money. The local dealer had sold my 1949 coupe originally (I’m the third owner) but when Pontiac died so did the business. Not sure what happened to that truck but it was real.
I still have my Aztek with 93K miles. Just put a new rear arrowhead on it and going to put some new tires on it soon. Love that car.
Crappy thing is I cant find some interior parts for it now. So I am now forced to use different colors from Rendezvous and Ventures.
C8.R
Great historical review on Pontiac. A+
More history from an insider/outsider:
John DeLorean got GM to grant his brother, Chuck, a Cadillac dealership on the west side of Cleveland when Cadillac was King of the Hill and Cleveland was a great and powerful city. In the heyday of Detroit, Michigan. Fifty some years ago when America was America.
Sadly, as the great cities of Detroit, Cleveland and the rest of the Rust Belt faltered along with the big three automakers, American steel makers, tire makers due to the Asian onslaught, discussion ensued with the good ol boy members of the Westwood Country Club in Rocky River, Ohio. Chuck DeLorean was a member. (BTW: Chuck hit three holes-in-one at Westwood and was a scratch golfer during his time at Westwood).
After a round of golf in the Westwood clubhouse the captains of Cleveland industry would discuss the auto industry, of which Cleveland was a major auto and truck parts producer back in the day, Eaton, TRW, Clevite, White, etc.
Discussion centered on the big three. Ford at that time was Cleveland’s largest employer with the Walton Hills Stamping Plant – now closed, Cleveland Castings Plant – now closed, Engine Plant # 2 – now closed. GM had Fisher Body Coit Road – now closed, Euclid Avenue Trim Plant-now closed, Brookpark Transmission – now closed. Euclid Earthmoving Division – now closed, a segment of Detroit Diesel – now closed.
The boys would discuss how GM was rotting from within from corporate politics – backstabbing, lavish junkets, internal infighting, favoritism, cronyism, etc. A perfect storm was brewing in their analysis. I overheard all of this as a kid at the Westwood Country Club in Rocky River, Ohio.
The inevitable did happen in time. GM jettisoning divisions, closing plants, eliminating divisions and the era of poor Roger Smith. The karma of excess came back to haunt General Motors. Just like a fat lady eating bon bons and chocolates, sitting all day long having her health deteriorate. This is the story of GM.
Now it’s a new do or die chapter for GM. From what I am seeing, I think the new GM is on track for a revived life. Warren Buffet at 92 years old is betting on this. Mary Barra may go down in history as one of the great ones. Success to all.
I am very familiar with the Norther Ohio area. Much of what you post is true but it is even more involved than that.
I am not an insider but I did grow up with a family member that was the old school Sloan era executive. He taught me much on GM and engineering. Sadly much of what he taught me is what was never changed till late and damaged GM.
GM for decades functioned as a corporation but was run like a bunch of separate companies, they should have been run to compliment each other but they failed to do that. It was so bad identical parts were sold under more than one part number and GM woul not pay the same price on each part,
Horrible union deals were made to the point it was cheaper to build cars and sell at a loss vs closing a plant down.
There were many thing they needed to do over the years but many leaders just kicked the can down the road.
John had the right idea 85% of the time. That is a good average vs the others. But John stepped on too many toes and paid a big price. His big ego got him far but he made a list of enemies and they set him up for failure at Chevy.
GM needed to work together and eliminate the number of models on the same platforms.
They just had too many of the same cars.
Then you the crazy panic in the 80’s to down size and make everything FWD. that cost a ton of money and did not work well.
GM has always had leading technology but too often they put it in cars long before it was ready.
To be honest GM is in a good place now. They have a good line of good selling CUV models and truck. They are in a good place to deal with EV regs and they are working to sell both ICE and EV as long as it is viable. They are not marketing this but that is what they are doing.
Right now Ford is in major trouble. Their income is down and they have loans to pay and an Electic vehicle program yet to fund.
They are laying off people to pay for the EV program.
If not for the Ford family owning 51% I think they may have been a take over target.
Mary has faced a great number of challenges. But GM is in a good spot right now. Dealing with all the changes, the political pressures, the web pressures, the technology issues, labor issues, Covid issues etc.
Imagine the parts shortage issues under the old GM.
The Pontiac end I have learned much as I have been a Pontiac historian for a number of years. I grew up with a number of Pontiac collectors and racers from the Tin Indian team in Akron. These guys from the glory era taught me much and you hear the non GM take on it much like you did.
Being involved with the Fiero I can show just how dysfunctional GM was on just this single program then you spread it out over all the other models. It shows how bad things were.
When I would talk about the issues at Pontiac everyone would say this is off the record and don’t use my name but this is what really happened.
I saw the documents from the meeting that killed the car. It really got bad as Pontiac was pissed at Chevy and GM. The URW was mad at Pontiac and GM was really upset with Pontiac. Those feelings still linger in a number of areas yet, most are retired but they are still bitter.
I know today the enthusiast are still upset but we are the small group here as the majority are the people looking for reliable good cars that get good mpg, safe and will not leave you stranded. This is why Hyundai sells as well as they do.
The general buying public no longer as a whole identify with their cars as most of do or did in the past. People used to be a Cadillac man but today no one is a Hyundai man. Loyalty for the most is gone.
Anyways this is still just the tip of the iceberg and much is what the general public was never exposed to.
I do recommend the Delorean book on a clear day you can see GM. Or Lutz book Bean counters vs Car Guys. Both give a small peek into the mess GM was. I wish more would read these and get a better idea how much better things are now. Perfect no but in difficult times they are doing better than most.
It is obvious you never had a Pontiac. I have over 200,000 miles on my 2006 Pontiac G6. I have used it every day. no issues, none! I had an oil leak, $50.00 to fix it. never a problem aside from oil changes, tires and it does not use oil and smooth running. The cleanest-looking car. I had a guy come up to me and started bad-mouthing Pontiacs. When I looked at him confused by his statement, he walked off talking to himself.
Maybe he owned a 74 V8 Ventura like me that needed a valve job at 12001 miles although the shaking started at 11000 miles along with moulding falling off going down the road equipped with tissue thin tires. I owned a 58 chieftain convertible and a 64 GTO but that Ventura was the last Pontiac I ever owned.
Not sure what point you are making here. No one said a G6 was bad but the problem was the G6 was not really a Pontiac.
Pontiac was really an engineering and performance brand at their peak and it was a strong image with their own engines and styling and performance.
By the time the G6 arrived it was just a rebodied Malibu. Yes a good transportation car but it offered nothing that the Malibu and Saturn Aura offered. GM needed to let the Performance division offer performance. The 2.0 Turbo at 260 HP would have set the GXP apart. But it lacked any real performance options other than spoilers.
Things like this hurt Pontiac. Lutz arrived and all he had money to do is bring the GTO here. But it was too late. Pontiac also needed their own tunes on these Chevy based engines but that never happened. Pontiac had this kind of stuff but were never permitted to use them by GM.
Pontiac become more a styling exercise that no one knew what to do with it at GM.
I agree they were good cars but they were nothing more or less that you could buy at Chevy and GM made the mistake not letting Pontiac to be different.
Good point with G5/Cobalt SS, but advocating JdL and Lutz isn’t 1 for 1 what would have worked for Pontiac and GM.
What was funny is the Lordstown plant built a G5 Turbo. They showed they had all that was need on the shelf to build the car but GM rejected it.
Imagine Pontiac offering that car with 260 HP and the GM Tune that made it 295 HP. It would have done well and even made dealers money on the tune install.
GM just did not want to upset Chevy and that is why Pontiac never was let to be what they should have been.
Pontiac absolutely needed to be in the sport compact game, over Chevy.
The sexed up front drive stuff was in their wheelhouse – when they’ve done that with Chevy’s, there’s always a large chunk of people put off. I feel that stigma holds today.
This is the deal The Cobalt SS was a very good car. It was very fast and handled well the same work was applied to the HHR SS and it was a killer package. Add the GM tune and it was right at 300 HP.
Here we had Pontiac they were the performance division and they had nothing. The GP was OK but it was not a sport compact.
The G5 and G6 both needed some life and power. The G6 GXP in particular. But you will find Chevy stood in the way.
The 86 2+2 needed a 305 HO like the Monte SS but it never got it. There were other models that needed help but GM would not let them have what they needed.
The real dumb thing was Pontiac did get the Series 3 3800 SC but Chevy was refused it. The Series 2 required premium fuel where the 3 it was optional. Chevy Could have use that. Then sticking a V8 in the Chevy and GP both was a mistake. The car was so detuned for the transaxle the V6 3800 SC was the better car. Less weight on the nose.
Imagine if GM would have taken the Cobalt and sold it as is and then let Pontiac use the tune from the factory to compliment the Chevy at a higher price.
Imagine if the Fiero was made to compliment and be a stepping stone to the Corvette.
GM divisions were like a puzzle but their parts all did not fit.
There used to be a ton of puzzle pieces, and many ideas may have been helpful. Powertrain distinction of the brands.
A smaller displacement LS (4.8?) may not have killed drivelines, and just removed any need for the supercharged 3.8. S-C the lighter 60 degree pushrod, and made Pontiac their F-i brand. Chevy is a muscle/truck brand, where buying outside those segments is value saving for one in it. Fiero would have needed to be allowed to be what the Z06 is now, with the Vette staying front-mid muscle. Very very debateable.
Here is what we do know.
The 5.3 in the GXP GP and N star in the GXP Bonneville was just to make up for the loss of the Firebird with the V8. The problem both were FWD and really not much faster than the 3800 SC. It also made the cars very nose heavy.
Chevy has always been value performance. They are the value brand but they took away the premium brand performance from the Firebird with cooperate engines.
To be honest the Fiero even if it had lived was not expected to make it past the second gen. Most lower cost sports cars are 5-10 year cars at best. The Miata is the exception.
The Fiero could have done well as a sub car to the Corvette and kept the lower pricing while the Corvette went higher priced. They could have complemented each other vs competing .
What really killed the Fiero was they built the car in a plant that could build 250,000 cars a year. To be honest they over sold the car in the first two years in six figures to try to make the plant viable till the GM 80 program came in. That was the FWD AWD F body no one wanted.
The GM 80 was canceled and the Fiero was pointed out to be well under capacity even with the volume at where they expected at just over 30K units a year. But on its own line it was not good financially.
Chevy used this to kill the car as making a case for the C5 was difficult and the new DOHC V6 had them worried about the Fiero.
What also a concern was Pontiac did build a V8 Fiero. The car was sized to accept one that is why the swaps are so easy. But GM killed that when they found it in Mesa Testing.
The truth is the Corvette and Fiero could have coexisted if they had worked together but GM failed to get them to do this.
Many never knew the C5 was canceled and only saved because Chevy hid the program. Once it was done GM gave the go ahead as it was a much better car. But the manager who hid it paid with his job.
We see all these post on the web of what GM should do and what they should not do but there is a lot more to all this than we often ever hear or see. I was lucky to get with the heads of the FIero program and they were willing to talk off the record. If not we would never have know the buried truth.
Pontiac was an engineers division but they were robbed of their ability to be different. This led to people coming in to Pontiac that were not even automotive people let alone performance people.
While we still get some that praise the Aztec well it was the right idea just the wrong styling and lack of power killed it. They could have saved the Aztec with some tweaks as Lutz saw one at the SEMA show with a much better nose. He asked his people on camera point blank why can’t we do something like this!
We can play all sorts of what if games with Pontiac but it was like the Titanic. They luckily killed it before it got damaged to the point the name could never be used again.
My hope is for all the negatives of EV the one positive is they can do more niche cars and make Pontiac a sub brand though Chevy. Or there are other options but till the EV market has gotten to where it needs to be and the economy recovers there will not be too many games by any mfg. The cost of the EV programs is devastation on the companies and only a few have a handle on it and GM is one.
Ford is laying off people to pay for theirs and others have hardly even started and the parts shortages and economy is going to make it even more difficult.
The cancelled C5 showed a massive lack of foresight. That drivetrain, including torque tube, should’ve been and still be the bedrock of all their performance offerings from then on. Speaking of light noses.
Is it safe to say the N-body coupes knocked off Fiero and GM-80? I do love the fact they had secret projects going.
The stance of cars got better with Lutz and the interiors (I’m not an interior snob).
A couple thoughts about EV (away from pro&con troll threads):
The Tesla truck is defensive move to get the ‘Legacy’ companies spending money on niches. -Instead of beating his bread and butter Y & 3 (where Pontiac might fit). And beating his charge network.
And now the Cathy Wood style hipster investors have lost their bull market beta. It’ll be tough sledding to gain funding for a while. –
The average citizen doesn’t believe or care about C02 levels. They should be caring about seeing a geopolitical resolving deal that breaks OPEC and pigeon holes the globalist/middle east producers.
Thanks C8.R. My 2 cents, or 20.
Well you have to recall the C4 was selling close to 12,000 units and GM was not exactly in great financial health even then.
Making a business case looking back is easy but back then there was no way to prove it was a sure thing. The LT engine is what brought this car to life. It was faster than a ZR1 and Cheaper. GM had to delay the engine till the ZR was gone. That was why it was late.
The N body Grand Am was a success according to the Pontiac people due to the new 3rd gen Firebird and Fiero. It got people into the show rooms and not many could live with a 2 seat car 24/7 but they could a Grand Am.
The GM 80 was a car the engineers did not want to start with and when the Mustang did not move to what became the Probe Ford kept the Fox platform so this got GM to stick to RWD and the 4th gen.
What is Ironic is the 4th gen F body used the Fiero GT 2nd gen styling adapted to a front engine car. The profiles were nearly identical and the dash panel was carrier over the 4th gen from the 1990 Fiero in tact. Schinella said it was too good to throw away.
Many things improved under Lutz and the culture began to change. They are much better and efficient today. Perfect no but much better than in the last 70 years.
Tesla truck is for shock value but I expect the shock will be worn off fast. It will play like the Y gull wing doors. More novelty than needed. The Stainless body will be like the Delorean cool till it ages or you want colors.
EV is not going away as too much money has been invested and the path is set. How fast the changes come may vary as the automakers are behind and as you can see GM is doing two of most models gas and EV to let the customers change at their own pace. But in the end regulations will force the change.
There is a lot of years and development to go so car will be very acceptable range and price wise by the time most are forced.
As for the Corvette and the C8 I suspect you were referring to with light noses. The cars performance is just amazing over any of the last coupe C models. The only way to make the car better was to move the engine. It is not just mid engine but the lower center of gravity and centering the mass on the chassis etc. It is not just about 50/50 balance but to have the mass closer to the center of the car that makes the greatest difference.
The Rear Transaxle cars are durable but when they break they are not really easier to work on. My Neighbors 8K mile car he bought had a failed fuel pump. They had to remove the tank, the exhaust and transaxle and suspension to change the pump. Later cars had a panel but not the early ones.
The move to mid engine was a long time coming and they nailed it. You now have a Zo6 that can out run a Ford GT at 1/5th the price.
Light noses by a rear trans has been my wish for front engine small-block cars/vehicles with rear seats.
Mixed material castings also by now to improve weight distribution.
Pony coupe, sedan, especially a tall hatch and Durango alternatives.
It’s an insult & tragedy that towel is being thrown in. EV won’t replace desire. Caddy frankly didn’t deserve what is available now.
I understand the mass centralization & aero advantage with C8. The buyer “boomer” transition going on is a bit awkward. I’m not concerned about it.
Thanks again
My dad left us a 2008 G6 when he passed and my wife used it to commute for 7 years before it too was also totaled, it did protect her as she only received a broken fingernail from the crash. The car was simple to maintain and it’s first set of tires went 80K miles. My wife had her eye on the new G8 which I intended to get her when Pontiac was shut down. I attend may car shows and cruises and the Pontiacs are always a favorite, sad to see Pontiac end the way it did.
Our 2007 G6 is arguably the best car we’ve ever owned. Oil changed regularly and 225k km has arrived with great reliability and few repairs. The little that has needed work is easily and economically fixed. After 16 years of harsh Canadian winters and road salt, some body rot is beginning to take hold, but overall, it stands as an exception to GM’s somewhat poor quality reputation from those economically troubled times.
Gostava da rebeldia dos fabricantes da Pontiac, faziam carros de aparências quentes. Há espaços para um retorno. Só falta vontade política da GM.
english!!!
Don’t be an ahole
Don’t be a woke a****
what happened to the last Hummer, Oldsmobile and Saturn too?
The last Olds was an Alero. It was in the museum in Lansing until it was sold during the bankruptcy. Like that G6, it wasn’t anything special.
thank you
Interestingly enough, that last Pontiac sold as a fleet unit. So probably to a rental company one would think.
I bought a 2009G-6 new and I still have it, great car!
I still see a lot of G6 on the road. It’s a shame when people say GM and US cars are garbage and drive imports with their nose in the air. I had a 2007 GP and traded it in on a 14 Impala and no breakdowns and nothing to fix; just changed, 4 brake pads, 4 wipers, tires, 1 can a power steering fluid, and oil changes. 15 years of no problems has saved me a crap load of money.
I retired my 2007 Grand Prix with 263K on the clock. Best car I have ever owned. Rust starting everywhere and a problematic transmission. 15 years on a daily driver isn’t bad. I hope to repeat this with my new car
The comments knocking the G8 is crazy the issue is it came out at wrong time in 2008 every car was heavliy discounted. I personally got 8k off my G8 GT msrp went from 32k to 24k Dec 08 gm finance was 30% at the time. But guess what at same time dodge charger was dicounted just as much f150 ans silverados the same. since G8 was just rebadged import cars the fact that gm didn’t kill pontiac and bring the g8 back as a buick was the real tragedy. Yes the SS came much later. But GM let dodge beat them at a segment they had locked up in Australia they could just import cars over and rule the rwd segment just price lower than ctsv. Oh yea I still own that g8gt with 180k never had check engine light but it does eat lower control arms for some reason. Best GM vehicle I ever owned.
Yup I got $9k off my 09 G6 new with GM discount and rebates.
If I got 9k off of a cheap car like a G6 I would have cashed it out on a real car ASAP.
Wrote a check for it and It’s still on the road, looking at it now. Times were pretty uncertain then so went for the economic model and worked out great. I will probably pass on to my grandkids.
“cashed it out on a real car ASAP”. Care to expand on that budlar?
I can’t wait to hear this one.
It is easy 9k off a cheap car means when that great deal goes away you should be able to flip/or trade it in for a profit If you are car dealer savvy enough to pull it off.
In today’s market, maybe so. But no way back then with cars dropping in value the second they are titled. Even in today’s crazy market which is beginning to correct itself, that’s not easy to do.
The G8 was not selling as people avoided Pontiac as a dying brand. I had the same offer on a G8 at the time.
Hummers were also real bargains but I held off due to the worry of resale on a orphan vehicle.
Today the G8 is doing well and the gas Hummer prices are crazy high.
If it was on a G8 V8 I would be tempted.
What stopped me was my wife wanted a SUV and it was going to be here car. It was a killer price for a car near $35K.
I remember that I could have the first year GTO w/ the LS1 in Jan of the next year for like 16k after rebates,discounts,dealer flex cash and gm card money.
It was just to ugly, I should of just bought it to flip it.
I once rented a G6 and took it on a trip from San Francisco down to LA, and back. Lots of high speed freeway driving, I found it incapable of settling into a straight line when at speed. It required a steady amount of small corrections to keep it going straight down the highway. Other than that, it was a fine car.
You had a rental car that needed an alignment?
That’s not exactly surprising.
I’m just glad to remember the Pontiacs of the 1960s and 70s – elegant, glamorous, distinctive styling and exciting performance from the likes of the GTO, the Grand Prix, the Firebird and the Bonneville. A different world.
All I know is my mutiline dealer sales manager told me they sold more pontiacs than buicks.
As the article says in a polite way it was all about China who had a fetish for buicks.
Danangme69: That may be true in the area you lived, but it was not true for the area I lived and sold cars. I’m sure things like this are quite demographically inspired. But where I sold in the mid-west, the Buick’s sold in much higher numbers than the Pontiac’s for most years. It is correct that the high sales in China did save the Buick line in the USA. Back in 2007, when it was clear GM was going to kill off Olds and Pontiac, we were very concerned that our Buick line would also go. When we found out that Buick was safe, the dealer owner found out from GM directly that it was the result of the China connection and sales. Some times I get a little frustrated with the Buick/China connection and I certainly wish Buick would be fully American (in terms of country or origin and assembly), but then I also need to remind myself that if not for the Chinese market we wouldn’t have Buick today.
Pontiac had its areas.
The Midwest was the greatest selling Pontiac market in the country. Chicago was the greatest sales area as was Michigan, Indiana and Ohio.
This is why Pontiac did most of their major introductions at the Chicago auto show every year.
Now that did change in the early 2000’s. The GTO was shipped to the Midwest where it did ok but sales were off the chart in California. They actually had to ship cars back to the west coast to fill orders. The G8 saw similar results.
Buick car sales after the LaSabre tanked. They actually had some great cars at the end but no one wanted them. The SUV thing took over and the Enclave became the face of Buick here.
The only think that kept most Buick dealers viable were the GMC and Denali models as these were high sales and profits. One dealer here was Pontiac GMC and not is just GMC refusing Buick and are more profitable today as the GMC dealer only.
Sold tons of Pontiacs here in Indiana and many are still on the road including mine! It’s our 3rd vehicle (backup) and my wife won’t let me sell it. She drives it shopping to save door dings on her Nox Premier.
I loved the last Gen Grand Prix GTP and GXP sedans! That said Pontiac was on the way out after the Fiero as C8.R stated. Pontiac was my favorite GM Division, I just loved how their cars were styled and their stance on the road was attractive. You see GM’s marques were not supposed to be mere brands but interdependent divisions within the corporation. GM threw out the baby with the bathwater when they were trying to reorganize and consolidate themselves, which led to their bankruptcy as they failed. When you leave a Chevy and go into a Pontiac on the same platform, you knew you were in a car that was more or less a step above in driving comfort and interior appointments. When your marques become just brands, you lose product differentiation as they share too many parts and power trains to save costs at the expense of customer loyalty and exclusivity.
GM now has a unique opportunity to bring back well known marques as sub brands on their Ultium platform, as successfully demonstrated by GMC with their Hummer sub brand. Pontiac can return as a upper level sub brand for Chevrolet with high performance, brand specific interior appointments, and dramatically styled EVs. Same thing can be attempted for a Oldsmobile sub brand, with limited production numbers of high styled superior driving dynamics large EV and plug in hybrid sedans using the Ultium battery system. I for one dont think Pontiac is really ‘dead’ it can comeback, if GM chooses to do so, and they can do so with the tech they have now.
Being a Ford fanatic I still do love my older and some newer GM’s in 2010 to 2017 I bought 4 Pontiac’s GXP And GT’s and at a great price in great shape and low mileage all under 70,000 ,, The only thing I’ve had to do is replace the aluminum calipers on the Pontiacs due to corrosion plugging I still consider Pontiacs a bargain ,Oldsmobile and Pontiacs ar the greatest Asset to GM performance that’s my say
Would be nice to see Pontiac back to life as an EV co. Love both my Solstice GXPs and would totally get a Tesla killer EV Solstice. j/s
I too have had several Pontiacs .
60 Catalina.
66 Catalina
73 Grand Prix
77 Bonneville
84 6000STE
and still own a 06 GTO
If I had a 06 GTO I would not want to look at it!!!
Just quick jump in it and mash the throttle.
I only mentioned my new ones, also had a 00 Grand Am, and 07 Solstice so we’ve had 6 including 4 new.
Very sad to see an iconic nameplate and one time great GM division mismanaged into oblivion. Great models that were standouts, Catalina, Bonneville, Grand Prix, Tempest, GTO, Firebird, etc. The managers after the Knudsens and DeLorean sadly mismanaged it to a death. God, please forgive them.
Where or where have all the great car people gone?
Pontiac was and always be the best car GM ever made.The lines are so sleek and we love all of them.My brother has a G8 and you wouldn’t believe the compliments he gets.we have always driven Pontiacs am The best car ever.
I have owned 3 Pontiacs…All 3 had well over 350,000 miles on them. Never let me down! Very few mechanical issues hardly had to replace any parts other than the normal brake pads and occasional starter or alternator. Totally reliable…I love pontiac!!!! I would buy one again and again!
I still have and love my 2006 Solstice.
Still have people comment on its great look.