It’s safe to say the new Cadillac CT5-V and CT4-V were a smidge disappointing. However, these two cars are not direct replacements for the beasts that were the CTS-V and ATS-V.
Instead, Cadillac is launching a two-tier V-Series strategy and teased the true next-generation V models at the Detroit Grand Prix this past June. According to GM Authority information obtained roughly a month ago, these cars will add the “Blackwing” moniker to their names for a full title of Cadillac CT5-V Blackwing and CT4-V Blackwing.
Now, there’s new information from Motor Trend’s Jonny Lieberman that despite the use of the “Blackwing” name, the twin-turbo 4.2-liter LTA V8Â Blackwing will not be part of the formula. Instead, Lieberman shared on his personal Instagram page that the CT5-V Blackwing will feature the CTS-V’s 6.2-liter LT4 supercharged V8. He added output is likely to increase marginally from the CTS-V’s 640 hp to perhaps as much as 670 hp.
More good news: there will be a manual transmission offered. A row-your-own option appeared to be missing from the CT5-V and CT4-V shown in June.
As for the CT4-V Blackwing, it’s expected to also borrow an engine from the past: the 3.6-liter twin-turbo V6 LF4 that served the ATS-V. As Lieberman noted, that’s a shame since the 6.2-liter LT1 V8 would be a lovely powerplant here. It too will pack a manual transmission more than likely.
Carryover powertrains have long been rumored for the next-level of V-Series cars. If both cars do bow without a Blackwing V8 under the hood, it will leave the CT6-V as the only model on sale with the hottest version of the DOHC twin-turbo V8.
It’s unclear when we’ll see the hopped-up sedans debut, but with the regular CT5-V and CT4-V just revealed, we imagine Cadillac will let its banner sport sedans bake a little while longer.
And to top it all off, Lieberman also stated that, despite previous reports, the next-level CT4-V and CT5-V might not use the Blackwing name.
Subscribe to GM Authority for more Cadillac CT5-V Blackwing news, Cadillac news, and around-the-clock GM news coverage.
Source: Jonny Lieberman, Instagram
Comments
I can only speculate that the CT4-V platform cannot support the added weight and physical size of the V8 LT4. I’m sure the car will be a rocket with the Twin Turbo V6 LF4. I’m sure the LT4 will be a great motor for the CT5-V.
The LT1 is not any heavier than the 3.0TT or 3.6TT.
The CT4 is on the Alpha2 platform, which is only a tweaked Alpha1.
Alpha1 is the basis of the Camaro ZL1, powered by the 650hp LT4 V8.
The ATS-V was originally planned to get the LT1 V8, but Cadillac’s president at the time (DC lobbyist Ferguson) said it needed a twin turbo V6 to be like BMW. Apparently he didn’t know the difference between an I6 and a V6.
It’s sad to see Cadillac continue down this misguided path of using a coarse and unrefined V6TT in place of a smooth V8 from GM’s most acclaimed engine series. In comparison tests the ATS-V always fell short on it’s powertrain compared to the Germans, yet when reviewers compared the Camaro SS to them they rank it’s powertrain superior.
Of course this GMA report could be wrong. It’s hard to understand why the Blackwing V8 was ever developed if Cadillac don’t plan to use it in any of their performance offerings. It’s superior power and NVH characteristics make it the logical choice over an LS V8 or an unbalanced V6TT.
Maybe it’s time to test the GM HQ water supply for lead?
GM makes Zero Sense the last 3 to 5 years. This is so stupid.
Lets spend 15 years making V Series into Something and then just throw it all away.
I would love to see the Ct5v with the. 6.2l Eng. With AWD 600 plus HP
Having owned a 2016 ATS-V and now a 2019 ATS-V, I absolutely love the power and handling of the twin-turbo V6. But, I would go for the 6.2 LT1 in a heartbeat! Or, better yet, the 7 liter small block from the older ZO6.
Would love the V8 cross crank sound that every Corvette has!
Caddy needs better marketing. They don’t even advertise the nurburgring times for the ATS-V which is definitely faster than the 7:27:88 that the benchmark BMW M4 did. People are lying and saying the ATS-V cannot break 8 minutes on the nurburgring!
Better Martketing Caddy.
And please do NOT make these cars in China as the rumor mill says!
If this car is made in China or uses 90% of it’s parts from China… I will just buy the German benchmark BMW M4 or BMW M5… they have much better interiors anyways.
Oh.. and Trump 2020!
A very very very rich man of the people according to Rush Limbo and Fox News!
Maybe the turbo engines are necessary for the lux-refined half of the trims? And thinking the (fully) V cars needed a 3.6tt and 4.2tt wasn’t for the best.
So, separate the Blackwing name from the LTA for these next level Vs: LT2 for the 4 and LT5 for the 5. It wouldn’t hurt that GM would likely make more money with those engines.
I’m glad to see the manual news. And I hope they follow through well with awd sticks in at least the (accessible) 4&5-Vs and CT4-V Blackwing (maybe go stick only).
So, let’s invest in a new engine and call it “Blackwing”. Let’s then put it in a car we might discontinue…or not.
Then, let’s take the V-series cars we’ve spent years making class competitive, and instead of building
on all of the years and effort put into this, let’s water that nomenclature down and call the two new faster cars “Blackwing” but without the Blackwing engine. You know the one that’s sitting over there in the corner gathering dust.
???????
Dear GM.
lead·er·ship
/ˈlēdərˌSHip/
noun
the action of leading a group of people or an organization.
“different styles of leadership”
synonyms:guidance, direction, authority, control, management, superintendence, supervision; More
the state or position of being a leader.
“the leadership of the party”
synonyms:headship, directorship, direction, governorship, governance, administration, jurisdiction, captaincy, superintendency, control, ascendancy, rule, command, power, mastery, domination, dominion, premiership, sovereignty.
At least these will still have amazing power and a manual! That’s the great news. But the confusion in their
thinking is beyond understandable.
I need a beer.
Exactly.
**cracks open a couple of beers, passes one to Zcat**
Amen, brother. The Cadillac naming convention/strategy/marketing continues to get murkier and more confusing by the day. Why the hell is there an aversion to regular model names? Lincoln is using some pretty cool-sounding names these days. Just sayin’.
Coming soon: The 2022 Cadillac ZXTC6 650iP OU812 Pinkfuzz
Shots, anyone?
You opened two beers and I only get one? Lol!
Someone help those people at GM for they know not what they do. Someone need to write a book on how to run a company for dummies and send to the board and all the managers at GM.
VCAT. This is, Zcat.
I think they already have that book.
The problem is, no one read it. In fact, I’m not sure they know how to read?
I can see a vision in the GM conference room. I’m seeing a dart board and Mary is blindfolded.
Now, I’m not Psycho/psychic, but I think wherever the dart lands; decision made?
If this is true, it’s definitely an odd decision. Let’s hope they have some clever marketing up their sleeve to explain to customers why neither car has the Blackwing engine, but the CT6 does (and isn’t called Blackwing). Maybe they’ll rename the Blackwing engine…or discontinue it along with the CT6?
670 horses? God damn. That thing will be a rocket.
But will be better with sport AWD or electric AWD.
They should copy the AWD on the BMW M5.
No AWD with the most powerful engine.
No MRC with the AWD.
No Blackwing engine for the Blackwing models.
That’s how you bankrupt an auto company.
What’s the difference between Cadillac Management and a kindergarten class? A kindergarten class has adult supervision.
Nice!
Blackwing means only one thing.. the twin-turbocharged DOHC-4v V8, any car in the Cadillac lineup that features the name Blackwing means it has the twin-turbo V8 period; to use the Blackwing name on other vehicle high performance models borders on insanity when Cadillac already has their V models as everyone around the world recognizes that a V variant of a specific model is the highest performance variant which usually involves the LT4 supercharged 6.2L V8.
Nothing wrong with the existing powertrains, especially if they get a slight bump in power…and maybe AWD as an option this time? The cars will drive great and should be competitive with the usual suspects.
I’m now pretty sure that the Cadillac ‘Blackwing’ engine is just a bespoke pet-project version of the twin-turbo V8 developed for Corvette. JDN wanted a Cadillac-exclusive engine, so they threw him a bone and developed a hot-vee variant of the new Corvette’s uplevel motor. Of course the Blackwing won’t be used in the Corvette – the Corvette engine program likely ‘birthed’ the Blackwing! Low-production bespoke versions of anything are expensive, so watch as the existing LT4 finds a home in the CT5-V Blackwing and high-performance Escalade, and the actual Blackwing engine fades into the sunset along with the (Stateside) CT6. They’ll have the engine in their hip pocket if they need it for another project, but otherwise I don’t get a feeling that Cadillac wants the Blackwing V8 hype to persist. If there were long-term plans, I would have expected a very different approach to the rollout of the engine and CT6-V – like ride-along test drives for reviewers in a development mule – instead of virtual radio silence and a delayed release of cars. They haven’t treated or promoted this engine as something that’s integral with the future of the brand, and the integrity of the Blackwing name they announced it with is no longer intact.
The Blackwing name was well-received, so is cribbed for the track-ready V-series Cadillac’s, and I’d bet that decision was hurriedly made only after JDN’s departure. Now that they seem to have established that a Blackwing vehicle doesn’t need the Blackwing V8, there’s actually no reason for the Escalade to be engineered for it. If (big IF) they’re determined to put a twin-turbo V8 in, they can simply use whichever variant of the ‘Vette engine that’s most likely to also get into the Yukon Denali or hi-po Tahoe.
Isn’t speculation fun!!! 😛
Actually the LF4 V6TT in the ATS-V is pretty universally panned as coarse and unrefined relative to the competition.
Competitors are using either V8TTs or I6TTs, both of which are inherently balanced engines and thus silky smooth. In comparison a 60 degree V6 is a coarse and unrefined engine that has no place in a high end luxury sports car.
You’re right about the LF4 perceptions, in the context of comparisons with the competition. I’ll clarify then, that specifically there’s “…nothing wrong with the [hp output] of the existing powertrains” and a slight bump would keep them numerically in the ballpark with the rest.
To be more competitive in that class of car, should the NVH be better…yes! Should the exhaust note be sexier..YES!!! 🙂
You guys left out the part where Jonny said since they don’t have the Blackwing motor then they will NOT be called Blackwing.
Is there anyone at GM who’s willing to step forward and clarify a roadmap for Cadillac’s performance trims?
They spent 15 years building the brand equity of ‘V’, and now they decide to cash in on it, but can’t seem to be able to explain what the plan is. It would be one thing if the V-series concept was a wholly new brand that was growing organically from scratch, but this is replacing a known commodity in the market which carries implied expectations. At the outset, they really needed to replace all or nothing about the V-series structure…but here we are.
If the Blackwing tag won’t be used without a BW engine, and the next-level CT4/5’s are using the existing engines, could I facetiously suggest we call the new models ‘V-Lite’ (great taste, less intimidating!) and ‘V-Classic’ (the same great taste you remember…)?
Makes perfect marketing sense to me. Kudos to Cadillac, if true, on the inclusion of manuals.
My 1941_ 62-Series was the only Caddy I had with a manual, though, I put a 48′ Caddy flathead with a manual into one of my 27′ Tee’s
The Twin-Turbo LF4 is no slouch. Would love to have one in a new 1LE Camaro.
I wonder of the reason for the TT V-6 is the indy car engine and GM must have a TT V-6 in their production car line up .
Wonder if the costs were reviewed – again – and a new decision was made regarding the DOHC 4V V8 engine in various displacements? Or a new decision made on what vehicles in the GM family would get a version of the DOHC 4V V8?
Caddy needs better marketing. They don’t even advertise the nurburgring times for the ATS-V which is definitely faster than the 7:27:88 that the benchmark BMW M4 did. People are lying and saying the ATS-V cannot break 8 minutes on the nurburgring!
They need to advertise more and better.
The CT6-V Blackwing should be marketed better. Old men like me need to see ads!
Better Martketing Caddy.
And please do NOT make these cars in China as the rumor mill says!
If this car is made in China or uses 90% of it’s parts from China… I will just buy the German benchmark BMW M4 or BMW M5… they have much better interiors anyways.
Oh.. and Trump 2020!
A very very very rich man of the people according to Rush Limbo and Fox News!
Read more: http://gmauthority.com/blog/2019/07/rumor-cadillac-ct5-v-blackwing-to-receive-supercharged-v8-ct4-v-blackwing-to-stick-with-twin-turbo-v6/#ixzz5ts0WqTqJ
Hey Karol, how’s the weather in Krakow?
😉
Krakaow is not that nice for me, but many people like it.
I prefer Warsaw.
Nice beer, nice people!
You know we have more Polish in Chicago than Warsaw?
Now that I am very old, I spend my time in Chicago and Warsaw.
I am so happy with President Trump and Fox News.
Except, this weekend was terrible! I am beyond sad with his latest display of racism. If our leader in Poland says something silimilar to that even less than that, we will kick him out in 1 hour. It is very sad in America now white people are showing their true colors.
I have my kids and grand children in America, all very successful.
Please when you see your friend who is white being racist, STOP them!
White people have all power in America, and the world will judge you by how you treat the people without power.
I am not sure how much the LT4 costs to build compared to the hand made blackwing. So maybe using an updated LT4 engine would keep the price reasonable since the CT4 and CT5 are going “down” one tier each as far as their target audience. Not saying a CT5-V will be cheaper than the outgoing CTS-V, however it could potentially go down slightly. Since they are changing the name for everything maybe the 4.2 TT V8 blackwing engine will change to something else. Personally I like the name blackwing for top tier models. The only car on the market that people associate name with the engine is the hellcat, so not really a big deal that the blackwing engine drops the name.
Some years ago Cadillac teased the idea of a performance variant that would be called “Blackfin”. I don’t think it ever launched but that was a very cool, Cadillac-specific name. Maybe Cadillac was uncomfortable with mention of its most famous legacy feature.
Don’t believe this BS, guys. I saw his post from his instagram… He does not even know the segments of these cars. Jonny Lieberman is an idiot.
Another wrong information on GMA….
I like news like this
No news here, brother. Just a fantasy inside of Lieberman’s head 🙂
He also wrote 700 hp for the CT5 in the same post.. Yeah, 700 hp for the D-segment car lol
CT5 will get the V8, but it won’t be the old one. Be ready for the Biturbo.
I don’t believe that this is the biggest problem GM faces. they need to push EVs so investors think of GM as a tech savvy company and invest. they know most all their customers want big SUVs and pickups so who is going to buy the EVs
Not sure why most everyone is trying so hard to be convinced by BS that does not make sense. If the next level V models are going to be called Blackwing, expect that engine in the car.
Not sure how light the Blackwing engine is but if the CT4 can get that engine, I expect less than 500 HP/TQ figure. But again, anything can happen.
I’d looooove to see the Blackwing V8 end up in the CT4-V Blackwing (if that’s the real name), because it actually makes logical sense, and the power output (and exhaust note!) would be a step up from the V6TT in the shorter-and-probably-lighter ATS-V.
However…the first-hand reports from people at the Detroit Grand Prix said that the CT4-V lapping the track sounded like it had a V6. (https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a27692341/cadillac-ct5-v-ct4-v-track-confirmed/). So unless there’s a third tier of V-series, in which the Blackwing V8 would reside, then a V6TT is the most likely candidate for the CT4-V Blackwing (…if that’s the only alternative to the -V).
670hp CT5-V with a stick would be badass…how about AWD?
80% sure that blackwing will have a AWD/RWD option because their competitors are pretty fast. It needs extra power in the front to hook. No doubt it’ll push 650-700hp with that AWD. And same old ATS-V might be even AWD because of the G80 M3 pushing close to 500hp with AWD which is crazy they better up their game up.
you are right. Caddlic should copy BMW more.
This could have been SO SIMPLE and SO MUCH BETTER — Mary Barra is a moron.
CT4 2.0T (237 hp / 258 lb-ft) = BASE engine for the non-enthuiasts
CT4 2.7T (310 hp / 348 lb-ft) = CTS-V (with the red slash V logo from the VSport as the sporty upgrade)
CT4 6.2 LT1 (460 hp / 465 lb-ft) = CT4-V (with proper checked flag V logo)
CT5 2.7T (310hp / 348 lb-ft) = BASE engine for non enthusiasts
CT5 3.0TT (404 hp / 400 lb-ft) = CT5-V with carry over CT6 Platinum engine as the sporty upgrade)
CT5 LT4 (650 hp / 640 lb-ft) = CT5-V with carry over CTS-V engine)
The 335 hp neutered 3.0TT engine? Why bother!?!! Scrap it.
That’s the right idea, and I’d suggest 2 changes:
– top-dog CT4-V needs closer to 500 hp (ideally still with a V8 soundtrack), to battle in the inevitable comparisons with M3 and C63, no matter what GM says the CT4 competes with
– with all the Alpha platform-specific development already done, the easiest solution for the mid-range CT5-V would have been to carry over the 3.6TT (420-hp / 430 lb.-ft.) from the CTS V-sport
…but at this point, these discussions are akin to shouting iceberg warnings to the Titanic from the dock in Liverpool, as it slips over the distant horizon. Bon voyage, Cadillac! 😛
the cadillac 4 series won’t hold a candle to the bmw m3… come on… let’s be honest with ourselves…
caddy should make cars for boomers… boomers are an industry unto themselves… please stop trying to be an american bmw… back when i was young… 60 years ago…. caddilacs were in the same league as the very best cars… much better than mercedes and bmw… why are they trying to be an american bmw? cadillac makes cars for old people like me… and… the good news is… there are many of us old guys around… cadillac should cater to us…
my kids like bmw…. when they are old… they will migrate to cadillac… just check the average age of cadillac owners….
stop pushing cadillac into an unwinnable war…. bmw and mercedes shoppers don’t look at cadillac… but cadillac buyers look at those brands…
cadillac is even copying the bmw nomenclature… it is beyond a joke! what happened to the DEVILLE etc… cars have names… the most successful auto manufacturer in the world, toyota, hasn’t followed the germans… be ORIGINAL!
@ Karol Wisniewski
Sorry, but that is tje job for BUICK. Again, this should be very simple. BUICK = COMFORT LUXURY. CADILLAC = SPORT LUXURY.
Clear, defined, delineation makes for a winning portfolio.
@Eric Nast
Looks like the problem would have solved itself! If launched in 2020 the CT4-V (checkered flag logo) could have used the LT2 engine from the Corvette C8 making 495 hp @ 6450 rpm with 470 lb-ft @ 5150 rpm. Unlike BMW and MB engines, this one will actually be reliable!
be honest with yourself… because I know that you are lying… reliability and GM don’t belong in the same sentence.
bmw and mb are not known for reliability… they’re not selling that… they sell the ultimate driving machine… whatever that is…
the corvette looks great… but it will not be reliable… the only reliable mid-engine car is porsche… and a GM product will never be cross-shopped with a porsche..
come on guys/gals… get a grip… cadillac is definitely trying to be an american bmw… that is a pond it can’t and shouldn’t swim in… it should cater to old farts like me…. leave bmw to young executive types…
also… stop harping on about the corvette… successful retired plumbers like my brother buy corvettes… zero refinement… i’m pretty sure the average age of a corvette owner/ buyer is 65 or maybe even 70… i always see 30 year old kids like my son in BMW M cars… they’re not looking at chevrolet (nice french name)..
Have you ever owned a Porsche or a BMW M-car or an AMG Mercedes? Well, I have owned ALL OF THE AFOREMENTIONED. Reliability of the M5 had gone from below average (E39) to terrible (E60) to just bad (F10). The M113 engine in the C55/E55 AMG has an air injection pump that is guaranteed to fail every 50~80,000 miles because it defaults to on when the relay goes bad. The M156 engine in the C63/E63 has lifters and camshafts that grind themselves to death because of mismatched hardness — bad enough to draw a class action suit. And, Porsche? You obviously haven;t heard of the IMS bearing which if not pre-emptively replaced will grenade the engine. GM Pushrod small blocks on the other hand are largely change the oil and drive it for 15 years without issue engines. And, if anything breaks the parts cost third as much as the European ones to replace.
GERMAN and RELIABLE do not belong in the same sentence! I’ll NEVER own a BMW M-car out of warranty. Heck, I won’t even own an N54 powered 335 out of warranty. If reliability is your 1st priority, buy a Lexus or better yet a 1990s Toyota. But post millennium American cars are a good compromise.
I agree with you… Toyota and Lexus are the best cars on the planet period…
You are not understanding my point… I am not saying BMWs are reliable… they’re not.. but they’re not selling them that way…
I am saying that Cadillac should not try to be the BMW of North America! It’s obvious that they are copying everything BMW… from the iDrive to the naming system…
Cadillac should stay in it’s lane… make cars for old farts like me… young professionals are not going to buy Cadillacs.. it’s old guys like me.. they are going to push us into Mercedes cars….
Who cares about the small block whatever? Make a car that old people like me can buy.. and drive nice and slowly on the highway with plenty of room inside!
You are too young to know what Cadillac was like many years ago… Cadillac was on top of Mercedes and BMW… now… let’s be honest… it’s not in the same league! That is the truth!
I put the packing order this way:
1. Mercedes
2. BMW
3. Audi
4. Lexus (should be number 1)
5. Infinity
6. Acura
7. Cadillac
8. Lincoln
Obviously Porsche is miles ahead of Mercedes…
the CT??? and… XT??? may as well as call it a Cadillac X5 etc.
Got it?
Cadillac Deville…. now there is a name!
Toyota Camry… a name!
Mazda3… trying to be a Japanese BMW…
no one is fooled!
We are old Americans and we have the money… we want a boat to float on the road…. not a Cadillac X5…
Got it Dwight?
I’d take an LT-anything over the alternatives…lol.
you guys have missed the point—all the units are setting in Detroit somewhere and have not been released because of emissions check by government!!!
All of the 2019 CT6-Vs with the 4.2L Blackwing V8 are indeed sitting at a dock (some since April) awaiting shipping, pending EPA certification. They’ll probably be released in September…hopefully.
Not sure what that has to do with the engine choices in the CT4/5, though.
i remember when a friend traded his caddy for a MB and complained about the rough ride.
EXACTLY!
stop trying to be an american bmw and make a floaty boat for us old guys…
at least the average age of a corvette owner is 71 years old!
EXCELLENT!