General Motors appears to be ignoring the growing full-size police crossover segment, giving rivals Ford Motor Company and Fiat Chrysler free reign to own the space.
In April, Ford Motor Company delivered 3,263 units of its Police Interceptor Utility, which is the police variant of the Ford Explorer. That’s on top of the 20,283 deliveries of the regular (non-police) Explorer, giving the Explorer and Police Interceptor Utility a cumulative total of 23,546 deliveries in April 2016.
Sales Numbers - Ford vs. GM vs. FCA - Full-Size Crossovers - April 2016 - United States
| MODEL | APR 16 / APR 15 | APRIL 16 | APRIL 15 | YTD 16 / YTD 15 | YTD 16 | YTD 15 |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| EXPLORER | +22.30% | 20,283 | 16,585 | +9.80% | 76,168 | 69,372 |
| POLICE INTERCEPTOR UTILITY | +44.44% | 3,263 | 2,259 | +31.96% | 10,793 | 8,179 |
| TRAVERSE | +6.20% | 12,186 | 11,475 | -7.85% | 39,105 | 42,434 |
| ENCLAVE | +1.62% | 4,523 | 4,451 | +1.19% | 17,457 | 17,252 |
| ACADIA | -20.11% | 7,004 | 8,767 | -12.22% | 25,575 | 29,136 |
| DURANGO | -1.94% | 5,411 | 5,518 | +27.41% | 25,504 | 20,017 |
GM rivals the Explorer with the trio of Lambda-based full-size crossovers: the Chevy Traverse, Buick Enclave, and GMC Acadia. Individually, those respectively accounted for 12,186, 4,523, and 7,004 sales totaling a cumulative 23,713 units, or 373 units more than the Ford Explorer and its police packaged variant. Notably, General Motors doesn’t offer any of its Lambda-based crossovers in police packages.
The other player in the full-size police crossover segment is the Dodge Durango. It accounted for a grand total of 6,434 units; to note, Fiat Chrysler doesn’t break out police sales individually.
All that makes us wonder if General Motors is ignoring the full-size police crossover segment and associated sales on purpose, or is it simply waiting to enter the space with the next-generation, 2018 Chevy Traverse?
What are your thoughts on the matter? Talk to us in the comments.
Comments
Cadillac could build a Police Cruiser Special using the new XT5 equipped with either 404 horsepower LGW twin-turbo 3.0L DOHC-4v V6 or the 464 hp LF4 twin-turbo 3.6L DOHC-4v V6; although a Buick Enclave with a L83 5.3L OHV-2v V8 pumping out 380 hp might be interesting.
Clearly you were just trying to be funny.
The problem is they really did not have one suited for the job. The Traverse was too large and the Nox was too small and neither offered a higher powered engine package that some departments demand.
This will change with the reshuffled line up.
The Traverse is the same size (save for an inch or two in bumper cover configuration) and in the same segment as the Explorer.
Spot on about the engine: the Lambdas would do great with the LGW or LF3… but neither one will fit.
Here is the problem.
The Chevy is a slight bit larger and has a longer wheel base. It is not real conducive for maneuverability as a the Ford.
Also the Ford is offered in a TT V6 package that can be used for pursuit where as the Chevy is not something I would want to be chasing sown someone with.
Now I am not a big Ford fan but if given the choice I would chose the Ford between the two if I had to chase someone down. Now for family use it would be the Chevy all the way.
I have intimate knowledge on the Chevy as one neighbor has one and my other neighbor also has a Explorer police cruiser siting right outside my out and we have talked much about his like and dislikes on it.
Even a local Dyno shop at no charge has offered to tune it to over 600 HP for free but the Sheriff has tuned down the offer.
Now with that said the Chevy based on the new Acadia would really play into this roll much better and with the right engine package could provide the needed power to get a leg up. The Turbo torque is where their advantage lies at Ford. The Chevy has it but you have to rev the crap out of it to find it. My Terrain runs fine from 3500-6500 But the turbo engines today have a lot of low end grunt and acceleration. That is what makes them so popular with people giving up V8 engines as most V8s do not have that kind of low torque.
This is why a laugh at people who don’t want GM to sell their cars to rental/ fleet sells. Keeping the factory’s humming along is a huge part if running a business.
As for the people that complain about the resale value of my car, well if you didn’t get rid of your car ever 3 or 4 years and you kept the car for 10 to 15 years then the value of that car wouldn’t matter! So that’s on you not GM, besides with a plunging resale value it allows people who can’t afford a nice to buy one that’s 3 or 4 years old!
You don’t seem to understand the business.
Rental fleets is a completely different ballgame than police vehicle sales and commercial fleet sales. The rental cars carry nearly zero margin; the latter two are very profitable, sometimes at or very near retail.
I just explained to you that resale value has zero meaning if you keep your car for 10 plus years!
So stop turning your car in every couple of years and you won’t have to worry about it
What you miss is two things Companies want people to buy more often and get better resale. Also they like to keep value up on lease turn in cars to get better resale for used models.
Today people are not like me where they take care of cars or are comfortable with a car that they will keep it 10-12 years. I do but few others do. They often like a I phone want the latest and next model.
I have seen many trade in on the Terrain forum for a newer model just to get a Denali or LED lights? Smart no but their money is green and for the taking.
The fleet sales are generally not a good thing but the police area is not a bad one. Generally these cars are not given away and do make a profit. They also do not flood the resale market like Rentals. do.
I think GM just got out for while because one they really did not have much to offer in police packages. Also they were more focused on higher profit segments. I see them re entering this segment and bringing cars more able to fill the needs of these segments.
There is a lot of things GM gave up for a while to make sure they did the things with the greatest return.
While I do see them re entering the Police segment I do not see them entering the fleet sale segment in the near future unless they have to unload cars due to a market drop.
Fleet sales are not a good thing for people that rely on those high resale values so they can move on from one car to the next. The car companies should not have to protect the people that buys their cars. If you don’t like or want to take the drop in value of a car then don’t buy one.
Reducing the amount of cars and trucks that are produced in order to protect a buyers resale value of that car is just dumb! Keeping the factories moving at as close to 100% as possible is what is important.
Are retail sales the most important yes, but to leave the rental sale to the rest of the industry is a waste of resources.
There is no reason why GM can’t do both sell plenty of cars and trucks to the retail and rental/fleet.
Ask me about my 2004 GTP that I owned for 9 years.
It was even a Comp G in top condition with just over 100,000 miles. No rust no wear and tear.
But because of the fleet sales to the rental car fleets and the large number of dealers offering the later GT cars at cheap lease rates the market was flooded with GP’s very similar to mine and left me with poor resale.
With low resale comes lower sales and return buyers. Chrysler has poor resale and lot of cars tilling around coming off cheap leases. It has killed their resale and also their return buyers. They have the lowest percentage other than Mitsubishi.
Today people love to have some residual value left in their cars to apply to the next purchase.
Just because you are busy and sell a lot of cars dose not make you profitable. We saw that in the last 30 years of GM as they tried to keep plants open because it was cheaper than shutting them down with the UAW contracts that made them pay the workers no matter if they were open or closed.
I ended up ok on the GTP as it stickered at $32,000 new but I only paid $24,000 GM and the dealer really did not make much on the car. I lost resale but I got it up front when I bought it.
There are some fleet sales and models that fit the Fleet model but not many. This is why Honda and Toyota have stayed away and generally only do them when it is in their best in interest. I is the old model of economics of supply and demand. Today you have to take care of the customer coming and going if you want them back as there is so many other places to go now. Brand loyalty is not what it once was for anyone.
How much retail value do you expect on a 9 year old car with 100k, not much in my opinion! If low resale value equals low return sells then explain to me how or why so many people purchased new cars year after year when GM use to lead the industry in fleet sells?
I never said anything about not making a profit, GM would zero issues making a profit while sending a few choice cars to the rental lots. In no way am I saying that every car and truck GM makes should be sent to the rental/fleet lots but those lots should be filled with sparks, sonics, cruzes! These cars are throw away cars after 7 or 8 years their values will be next to nothing regardless of who bought it.
So resale value is a complete joke when people complain about it, GM can have both if they plan for it. Profits while having a steady supply of fleet vehicles.
In this day and age of higher and higher priced cars residual values and trade values are key for many customers to return to a brand.
My GTP should have garnered at least 10-12K but was pressed to hit 8K. While you would not pay that many people will pay that for a used car as they can not pony up the 35K for a new one.
Here is the deal. No matter what your preference is the market has a strong selling point with trade in and resale values. People hate the high prices as it is and if they lose more money that deters most buyers. Toyota and Honda have enjoyed a high resale value. While they are cars I do not want they help sell a lot of cars as most auto buyer see value in this.
In the old days GM Fleet sale vehicles had horrible resale. W body cars and J body suffered much on the market as GM dumped fleet sale cars on the market. Dealers also hated it unless they were connected to get them for used sales.
The reason people are still buying GM is the fact they now are finally making more appealing and higher quality products not because of fleet sales.
Right now GM is doing it right by using old out going models as classic models and fleeting these. They can get a couple years out of them making more money and not damaging the resale values of the new models with a flood of cheap rental turn in cars.
GM cars tend not to be throw aways as most do not take a lot of maintenance to keep on the road and rust holds off for about 12-15 years even in the snow belt. Most use chain drive on cams that last several hundred thousand miles etc.
The key here is to build better cars and then you do not have to dump them on rental fleets and make money on each one.
This is a case of working smarter not harder. Sure you can build a ton of cars and dump them on the market cheap and make less than you would if you just made them better and sold them at an ATP that is higher. The owner then can come back and better afford a new car as it hold greater value at trade toward a new model.
What I am stating is not my idea or my vision. It is how the market works and it is very well understood in the industry,
GM only did fleets as the UAW contracts at the Old GM paid the workers nearly their full pay even laid off. This hemorrhage was killing GM so they kept the plants open as they could at least dump cars on fleets as not making anything at all.
Today they have eliminated this part of the contract at most plants and they have been able to keep inventory of most cars to levels that keep ATP up, Resale up and customers happy with the value they derive from their purchase. Customers are happy and the company is more profitable. It is a Win Win.
Now that is how it works. You may not want to agree with this but this is how it works.
Your worried about a couple of grand on a trade in, wow I didn’t think people were that cheap!
The fact of the matter is this you as a customer control weather you lose money when you buy a car, it’s not the manufacturers job to protect you from yourself!
If you buy a car now and you keep it for 15 plus years the resale value won’t be a issue!
So what this tells me is that you can’t control yourself from buying a new car ever few years. So because of this you must pay!
Makes sense guys. A rental car company like Chrysler gives no incentive to buy the newest greatest model, because if you do, you’ll get stung on the trade in because there will be 5 more 3 year old 200s will sell for cheap.
Yes, I bought a rental special 07 GP in 08 for 12k and I liked it. I liked the car and loved the price and dependability. If I had bought a new one for 25k and traded it in on a G8, I’d been very upset.
I never understood why the new Ford’s caught on anyway. A turbo is probably the worst thing for a police department, especially this Ford junk. Sometimes they’ll have to start the car and go and go fast, won’t allow for a cool down before Its shut off, Engine only designed to last 150,000 miles and a turbo 70,000. Probably why I’m still seeing more Tahoes than I am Ford PIU’s
Well as of now my neighbor loves his cruiser and has had no issues.
Todays turbo engines will go as far as any other engine. With the upgraded parts and the better oils and systems today these engine are not like the old T type engines of the past.
I know some HHR SS guys that have easily cleared the 200,000 mile mark with no tear downs or major failures.
FYI you no longer have to do the cool down deal with today’s modern engines. Thanks to water cooling, better bearings and the use of Mobil 1 there is no issues with coking of the oil lines anymore.
Add to this the forged cranks rods and pistons or powder rods these engines are as durable as any.
Exactly! Tahoe’s are a truck based body on frame SUV. Much stronger and used for pit maneuvers as the frame holds up unlike the unibody sub framed Ford CUVs. Not to mention reliable small block V8 low end power with no turbo to fail. I see new and old Tahoe’s everywhere here in the Phoenix Metro whether it’s DPS, Phx PD or County officers. Hardly any Exploders or Expeds and it’s for a reason.
To explain why the new Ford PPV caught on is very simple and has two justifiable reasons. First reason is simple, the Ford is $8,000 less than the Tahoe. When you are dealing with a municipality that needs 10 new units $80,000 is a chunk of money. The second reason is the sour taste GM left regarding up fitting: typically the up fit equipment lasts through 2-3 vehicles and some parts and pieces last longer. Until you change the body style and absolutely NOTHING can be recycled sans the radio. It didn’t help when end users ordered thier budgeted Tahoe’s and had no idea they had to go back and spend another $15 to $25K per unit to enable the PPV to go into service. The easiest way draw them back to the Tahoe PPV is to drop in the 6.2 as an option to compete head to head with the Ford. The Ford Explorer Eco Boost V6 provides the GM 5.3 solid competition.
As far as the Lambda-based platform as a PPV being compared the the Explorer, please forgive me for stating the blatantly obvious: the GM product is really a mini van with lipstick and we all know it but won’t say it out loud.
GM has been ignoring this and various other segments. Better and more product planning would help I think.
Let’s not forget GM had the police car business for three decades and walked away from it giving the business to Ford. Seems they wanted the engines for the truck business. You don’t treat your customers that way. Anyways Ford picked up a 100,000 units who cares! Now you want back in?
When it comes to police departments it is all about price, MPG and Maintenance. You give them the best deal they will buy it. You do this at the right price then you will make money from it. Not a ton of money but better than general fleet.
The police captain of a local department oversaw the purchase of their cars and he was all for performance, a price that got the most cars for him and MPG as it was also a big part of their budgets. Getting new taxes passed is difficult and if you can give them relieve on this they will buy what you have no matter what Loyalty only goes as far as Sheriff Andy anymore all else have major budgets they have to stretch.
And Lambda crossovers (imagine: Traverse or Acadia for police, Enclave being too expensive, I think) simply don’t have the engine with enough oomph for police pursuits.
The only engine powering Lambda crossovers is LLT which is around 10 years old now, does not have any turbo options, and is good enough for family hauling but nowhere near Ford’s EcoBoost Turbo V6 in the Explorer. That’s the reason there is no Traverse or Acadia for enforcement agencies, I think.
The way that cops drive, I don’t see crossovers being very durable. They aren’t afraid to go off-road or use it to push another vehicle off the road; unibody vehicles aren’t built to do those activities.
The “switch” from trucks to cars/crossovers has already happened. The Dodge Charger plus the Ford Explorer and Taurus are the best-selling police vehicles… all are cars or car-based crossovers. And they don’t seem to mind.
Price and MPG are why!
It is happening because there is not much else to choose from. I work for a state government and they made a big deal out of this. The state troopers I have talked to do mind, they liked the Crown Victoria because it is BOF architecture can be used to push cars off of the freeway and it won’t bend the heck out of the vehicle in the process. They also liked the Charger for its handling.
We do have a combination of Chargers, Crown Vics, Tahoes, Durangos, and Explorers with each used for a different purpose. The Crown Vics are favored.
They are ignoring it the same as the hot hatch category & the Raptor.They need to bring the Trailblazer/Envoy back.
They are not ignoring them they just have other segments to address first that produce more profits.
The fact is while things like the Raptors are high profile there are less exciting segments that make more money that need addressed first.
Kind like eating you broccoli first before you get desert.
GM will get there but they needed to shore up their lines before they address the smaller segments. The fact is they had a lot to do coming out of Chapter 11 and still have some more work to do.
Most Police Departments will not purchase a vehicle for patrol work if it is not pursuit rated. For example the Chevrolet Tahoe PPV has been very well received over the last decade. The current Dodge Durango has a Service Package but is not rated as a police pursuit vehicle. The most popular Ford Utility (Explorer) Police Interceptor is the one equipped with the 3.7 liter HO V-6 featuring 304 HP and 279 lbs torque. If the new 3.6 liter V-6 in the upcoming 2018 Chevrolet Traverse is rated at 300-310 HP and 275 lbs torque then GM would be right in the ball game if they decided to do a Traverse PPV in the future.
Not just an engine is needed but a suspension package able to support it. They will need to address that too.
Both the Michigan State Police and the Los Angeles Sheriff’s Department conduct annual tests on all vehicles that are police pursuit vehicles. These verified test results are then made available to all departments across the country. While the Michigan State Police utilize the Ford Utility Police Interceptor with the 3.5 Liter EB SHO TTC V-6, many other departments are going with the standard 3.7 Liter Ho V-6.
Today’s Police Pursuit vehicles include heavy duty brakes, a heavy duty cooling system, a battery/alternator system capable of running emergency lights and communications for 120 minutes with the engine off, a heavy duty suspension, ballistic shields in the doors, steel wheels along with pursuit rated tires Goodyear RSA’s), an interior electrical tray with a fan to handle the myriad of technology and electronic equipment, a speed certified speedometer and many other pieces of non civilian equipment.
2017 is the last year for the Caprice and Impala police cars so Gm will be almost a non player in the police market. The local city police are in the process of replacing there 300+ Impala’s with the Ford Utility Police Interceptor.
I think it might be the fact that GM already have the Tahoe as the police SUV.
GM gave up on this segment back in the late 90’s when they owned it with the Caprice once they abandoned the RWD car they handed the market to FORD and have not looked back.I predict they will not get serious about it in the future due to low profit margins of government fleet sales.
I agree that GM has given up on this market along with the rental and fleet markets as well. Low profit margins and it does nothing for the image of the product.
I agree with Brad. GM has to stop being stubborn and bring the Trailblazer here! It has a body on frame design which can withstand special service driving better than unibody crossovers. Again,as I have stated in the past, enough soccer mom crossovers exist with multiple seating arrangements. You already have a vehicle that no one else has. A midsize, real truck chassis SUV. Let’s get this done and bring the Trailblazer back home where it belongs!!!
I doubt they’d use the next gen traverse only because they’ll probably need to change a lot of stuff to make it pursuit rated. I think they could use the new Acadia because the suspension in that will probably already be stiffer than the next traverse so converting to ppv would be easier. I also agree with what some people have said about bringing the trailblazer back but it would probably cost too much to really gain enough traction. And, while on the topics of ppv’s, i have a feeling the caprice replacement with be the next holden commadore, or based more closely upon the new lacrosse.
JEEP will special order a JEEP Grand Cherokee as a Police Vehicle, however they tend to divert these customers to the less popular DURANGO to maintain its numbers, both are reportedly built upon the same platform. As for the Contrast between GM and FMC over its mid size SUV SSVs. Chevrolet reports it sells every PPV Tahoe produced in Arlington Texas, and departments reportedly find these PPV Tahoes are easier to remarket and bring greater value at the end of their Service, not so much for the Explorer based Utility.