You may have already heard about the Cadillac ATS sunroof recall, which was prompted by insufficient recess on the Slide and Tilt switches on ATS Sedans equipped with the optional sunroof.
The recess did not comply with federal standards, thereby allowing the sunroof to be closed with less force than necessary to comply with federal standards. Given that no crashes, injuries, or fatalities have been associated with the condition, we’d call the recall and associated federal standards “dumb and unnecessary”… but Cadillac’s solution to the recall isn’t any better.
To comply with said federal regulations, Cadillac is having dealers replace the sunroof switch trim plate. The problem is that the new switch trim plate doesn’t exactly look good. Witness the before and after:
Before the recall: notice the area leading up to sunroof controls is flat. Click to expand.
After the recall: notice the area leading up to the sunroof controls has a bump so as to increase the button’s recess. Click to expand.
To us, the new new plate makes the (already not-very-attractive) overhead console look like it’s from the era when computers were all beige and ran Windows 95. Not only that, but the new, fatter trim plate also hides the Tilt and Slide buttons, requiring the driver to look under the buttons to access them.
All in all, we would have liked to see Cadillac design a better solution to this particular recall, especially given that we’re talking luxury products for a brand that is trying to rebuild itself.
Comments
C’mon Caddy, this is F**kin Disgraceful!!!!!
Not very elegant, its not a rip out your guts and throw them at the screen disaster however, relax.
I agree that the recall is dumb though. I imagine its a quick fix because there is a whole interior overhaul coming in the next 12 months probably. Though who looks at their sunroof controls, one you used them twice, you pretty much know what each button does and can operate them without looking.
I like windows 95….
What a disgrace.
Sunroof switches =ok
Sunroof switches with plastic raised edge around them = end of mankind as we know it.
Cool heads people, most won’t care or notice at all……
Why do people buy luxury cars? What makes luxury cars so desirable? Why are luxury cars more than twice the price of their similarly-sized mainstream counterparts?
The answer to all of those questions: higher quality, better engineering, closer attention to detail.
Does what you see above meet any one of those definitions?
Of course not. So yes, someone with a “cool head” would say that the solution of the recall is a poor answer to a problem that should not have been there in the first place.
What Cadillac should aim to do is engineer vehicles in a way that delight people, where every single touch point, every single surface, every single feature and piece of equipment makes people proud and gives them a feeling of happiness that they bought a Cadillac. What Cadillac should NOT do is engineer a car, cut corners, and then secretly hope that “most” won’t care or notice at all”. That sounds like a sure-fire shortcut to sell less products, do the opposite of delighting customers, and wind up in the automotive graveyard alongside Pontiac, Saturn, Oldsmobile, and others.
Relax…count to 10….go to your happy place….
Its not an engineering or quality issue, its a BS federal issue.
Given that I live this stuff and do this for a living, this is my happy place. I can’t be happier. Did you detect that I wasn’t happy in my comment? How?! How did you do that? I want those talents! Please tell me, how!? 🙂
On a more serious note: the issue seen here is actually an engineering/design issue. The fact that the original switches do not meet federal regulations is an issue with GM/Cadillac engineering not having done their homework. It’s a BS law/standard, agreed.
Keep in mind that the standard related to the recess of the sunroof switches has not changed since 1998, so making these things is nothing new to GM nor to Cadillac. It should have been done correctly the first time. But either way. It wasn’t done correctly. So a recall was made.
The bigger issue is that if Cadillac were truly serious about delighting customers, it would have delivered a more elegant solution that would have addressed the federal regulations. There are several ways that this could have been done, including replacing the entire overhead assembly and dropping the other controls that don’t control the sunroof. Point is the overhead console on these cars is ugly enough as it is… and this “fix” makes it even uglier.
What is it that you do for a living?
Professionally Bitch about things?
And if so, do you need to do post graduate work or can you just jump right in?
He’s the author little buddy. That moment when Mr. F’s face turns red from embarrassment… priceless.
I see, so I was right, professional bitcher…..thanks Little Buddy…..
Thank you for so eloquently and accurately describing what I do. You’re a good egg. And I am deeply wounded and offended. Gonna to go try and make myself feel better by driving my ’15 CTS Vsport. Peace!
The most disturbing aspect is the original car was not engineered to meet federal standards. What else in the vehicle doesn’t meet standards if you can’t even correctly design the buttons for the sunroof.
This is something like the 8th – 10th recall I’ve had on my ATS. Royal pain in the….Taking the time to run back to the dealer when I’d rather be doing something else. On top of it all, the dealership is not next door. I really don’t relish the thought of being on a first name basis with every service advisor at my dealership.
Standard of the world–NOT. Hey Mary, what happened to no more crappy cars?
It’s not a crappy car, as you know. But it’s just not a class- or segment-leading car, either. Sadly, the Germans still are.
Cadillac needs to stop making dumb choices in the way it addresses details. Case in point: no auto-dimming rear-view mirror on the passenger side on ANY Cadillac save for the Escalade, the way it’s addressing this recall, etc. The luxury segment is all about details. Sadly, Cadillac isn’t about details yet. And I have yet to see evidence of the new management team being too eager to address them, either.
PS: my friend’s 2010 BMW 328i has had 9 recalls… so let’s not even talk about quantity.
Chris,
offhand I thought there is about 3-4 recalls on the ATS not 8-10 as Martin has stated.
Chris,
Sure you have read my rants in other posts. Recalls are not only disappointment. I’ve had numerous warranty visits for an entire DIC that needed to be replaced(multiple visits), defective right side blind alert that wouldn’t go off, even with the car was shut off(multiple visits), currently have on order parts for steering–believe are steering knuckles, that will result in multiple visits. Sorry to differ with you–it is a crappy car! When I went back into my service folder also had forgotten about the windshield having to be replaced the week after the car was delivered since it was delivered to the dealer with a delaminating windshield and yes one of the transmitters had to be replaced. Yes definitely meets the requirements of a crappy car. I’ve had more issues with this car than any of the other 25 GM cars I owned.
Joe — I think you’re right. Currently, the ATS has 4 recalls on it that I am aware of:
2 for the sunroof (the same recall)
1 for the brake pedal bracket
1 for the rear defroster
Martin — it does suck that yours seems to be a problematic unit. Luckily, there is a warranty for that. But keep in mind that your experience is not representative of all ATSes. Last month, the car had the lowest PPH of its segment (no references here’s as PPH is an internal GM measure). Also, do you think you would have been better off with a BMW, Benz, Audi, or otherwise? An ex-colleague of mine has sunken the amount of money he spent on his B8 Audi A4 getting it fixed (no warranty).
Chris and Joe
Your forgot Transmission Range Selector Level Cable and Seat mounting hook welds.
Chris would suggest you look at another real world measure for the quality of the ATS–Consumer Reports customer reliability ratings. This is the one aspect that prohibits them from recommending the vehicle.
Do I think I would have been better off with a BMW, Benz, or Audi–Yes definitely. And when I am shopping to replace the ATS next year, for the first time in my car-buying life will cross shop GM and will probably factor in additional money for the Germans options since they do build a better vehicle!
Ah, that’s for the automatics and I think the seat hooks are for 2013-2014. But either way, you’re right.
I don’t put too much faith in CR myself due to some questionable decisions of theirs in the past to recommend and not recommend others (like Toyota Matrix and Pontiac Vibe, both made by Toyota on the same line with the same parts by the same workers, yet only the former was recommended). But nonetheless, many German luxury vehicles don’t get the CR recommendations either.
Now, I can’t say whether or not you would have been better off with a vehicle of a competitor. But I can say that you could have had a similar experience with them as well (Audi has recalled all 2009-2015 A4s for their airbags last year, for instance). I can dig up countless cases of dissatisfied BMW, Benz, and Audi owners online who have had countless problems and lemons. It’s a gamble for anyone who buys a car nowadays. You just happened to have gotten a case of back luck, which is luckily covered by the warranty. I would write to Mr. Johan de Nysschen about your experience directly.
I also don’t know when you will be in the market for your next car… and I have a feeling that the revisions and next generation vehicles will see some of these issues addressed. I have high hopes for Cadillac and Johan & company to turn the ship around in a way that makes us all proud, by not only by designing, building class-leading, world-class cars with features and equipment as needed… but also by building reliable and bullet-proof vehicles. They’re 90% there now, in my opinion. But as they say in the movie Waiting, the difference between ordinary and extra-ordinary is that little “extra”.
that car looks like its diving into the ground…with a broken sun roof.
Yet another “value-added” comment about your personal opinion of Cadillac design. Sorry rye, but you’re on your own on this one.
Thank God that the government solved all the other problems so they can turn their attention to this issue.
The fact that there is “federal standard for sunroof closing” makes me think that the government has waaaaaaaay too much time on its hands, its a sunroof, not a an industrial thresher…..
Yes, agree. It’s a stupid federal standard. But somehow, the Germans (among others) find a way to handle this without recalls by doing it right the first time.
is there anything that says you need to get this fixed? just don’t do it.
No, but consumers don’t know that this is even a recall. Their dealers will do this for them automatically. And even if consumers did know, they would not know what the solution is.
And the solution is shitty.
The solution is the equivalent of putting a matchbook under an uneven table leg.
Sorry…
Long way to go for Cadillac to go to be world class.
Maybe Yogi Barra and her gang will see that in Frankfurt.
Two things in the industry we all must keep in mind here when viewing this.
#1 This situation sucks no matter how you look at it. The problem and the repair.
#2 Meeting the standards of the Federal Government are not always cut and dry. They lay down an outline and you need to figure it out and still design something that is appealing and easy to use while meeting a general outline for every car in the industry. This is not as easy as it sounds.
#3 Fixes are also not as easy as one may think. It would be interesting to see just what the engineering requirements are to understand why they did what they did. I suspect that putting a switch that was in deeper was not a possibility due to space or the shape of the console. If that is the case they had to move to the outside. Based on the regulations and requirements of the government anything short of replacing the console may have not met the regulation and that is big money.
I do not like the fix either but I would like to see more information before I tie the company or government to the stake. It may make it clear why we got what we got or it may condemn them.
Most times fixes work out but companies do make mistakes. The key fix in the Camaro where they cut the key from the Fob leaving a gap in the Fob was a major blunder too on a BS Government deal. First off a knee hitting the key was a very remote issue and GM should have at least make a gap filler panel for the fob.
What I would be interested to know is if this part is just stuck on so the owner can easily remove it. This may have been what they did to make it so the owner can decide if they want this on or not. I have seen fixes like this before. I even had a dealer who had to do a recall tell me to remove a seal on the deck lid before I came in as they were required to remove it. The seal really was not a part of the issue but they were forced to remove it. This would let water in and leak right down onto the engine. Today these strips sell for big money as they are so hard to find. They are called recall strips and there is a high demand.
It is Unfortunate we will never hear all the reasons and facts here so continue to vent your personal observations.
Yeah, you’re right overall, scott. It’s just somewhat disheartening and disappointing to someone who bought a $50,000 ATS (a neighbor of mine) to see her first experience be this, showing a lack of attention to detail in the design/development process and when it comes to fixing it. Everyone should expect more from Cadillac and to hold them to a higher standard.
Chris I suspect the part comes off very easy and the owner can restore this to the original appearance. This may have been the unspoken idea of this?
I know GM does not always get it right all the time but most times they do.
Even at Cadillac there are time limitations and even on a $50K car they can not replace the console on the roof in every car out there.
This was a BS recall and the fix appear easily reversible back to how it was intended to be used. It would not the be the first time I have seen an easily defeat able government regulated thing on a car.
The real issue here is that this gives fodder to the on line tune up experts to pick at.
Now if this had been designed from the get go like this then we would have room to bit$ch.
My T top in my Fiero has a retro fit light console and it contains the sub woofer switch. It is set in deeper but since they only made so many T top cars I can understand way it is like it is. It would be too expensive to tool up for 1200 cars.
Well, the part replaces the original part… so taking it off would be the equivalent of leaving a nice hole in the overhead console.
It looks like the buttons mount to the larger panel by being bolted from the top. If that is the case, I wonder why they didn’t simply add a spacer between the panel and the button assembly. (similar to installing thicker head gaskets to increase the combustion chamber volume) It would have only added about 10-15 minutes labor and resulted in little significant change in appearance.
I shocked at the fact we have a “federal standard” for sunroof switches. GTFO lol
It looks as if Cadillac went to Gm’s huge parts bin and found a part that they thought would fit and used it .
It’s so true that when you spend 50 grand for an auto you expect better than this ” band-aid” approach . It’s things like this that will help destroy Cadillacs image . Not to mention the return customer base . Even though this recall may seem to be TOTAL BS , it shows that from the top down things got overlooked just like the Old GM .
My V was built July 20th no one knows what’s going on or when it will arrive! Great job GM ordered this feb 10th to be the last person to get should have got a BMW!!
I just had my ATS in yesterday for the skylight and rear defroster recalls. I didn’t recognize my car driving it out of the dealership. The ceiling of my car is no longer cream, it’s black! And, this was done without any warning. Did Cadillac change anyone else’s ceiling liner when having the skylight panel replaced? I’m so disappointed!
The solution to the recall definitely dates the car. It looks like a much older model. Hopefully Cadillac will come up with a better solution than this. Thanks for sharing this.