Within the General Motors lineup, there are several performance vehicles to choose from. Whether its a brutish Chevy Camaro ZL1, an M5-fighting CTS-V, or a ballistic Corvette Z06, each of these machines bring a different theme and feel to the table, to accommodate different desires. Looking back, there was the Pontiac Solstice GXP, which provided plenty of punch — not nearly as much as the V8 firebreathers listed above — but throwing it around didn’t feel like wrestling your dad when you were five years old.
With the Camaro ZL1, we get a big, but ultimately powerful 580-horsepower Ford Mustang antithesis. The horsepower number is enough to make a statement, no matter how heavy the car is. With the CTS-V, it’s more of the same formula: the addition of power to compensate for weight. The Corvette Z06, on the other hand, weighs much less than the other two, but is also significantly less powerful. Despite this, the Z06 will still take both the Camaro and the Caddy around the track for a nice seafood dinner, and then never call either of them again. But does it matter? Is the power of power simply more meaningful than a more nimble power-to-weight ratio?
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Don’t get me wrong, I love all types of sports cars and love muscle cars, but with my personal driving preferences I prefer something I can whip around like a Cobalt SS (RIP), Lancer Evo, Golf GTI/Jetta GLI, or Impreza Wrx STI. I really wish America built a car like that for my young self, and a lot of enthusiastic youngsters.
Justin how do you feel about the Code 130R or Tru 140s? Wouldn’t one of those fit the bill?
I love the Code 130R, (not really fond of the Tru 140S) but I think it would be a lot easier for Chevy to build a Cruze SS.
@Manoli, no I am talking about a lone group, I still here a lot of hype about RWD.
You make it sound like our generation doesn’t enjoy RWD.
Power to weight.
I wouldn’t care if a version of the Gen V block was 4.5L and had only 375hp and 350tq. If it was shoehorned into a C(x) that had a live weight of 1200KG, then the only problem it would have would be getting it to hook.
More power, less weight. Same difference.
Simply, yes. But let’s talk about lighter cars/lighter power to heavier cars w/ more power. Solstice GXP versus… say… Camaro SS. Two very different performance cars. Still fun, but… which one?
Last I checked, force = mass x acceleration…so either increasing the force or decreasing mass will create the same desired affect.
The answer to your ‘or’ question is yes – both! I have a Camaro SS and the wife has a Solstice GXP. We both enjoy the power-to-weight of the nimble GXP -AND- the muscle of the SS. Our next car will likely be a Vett but probably not a Z06.
@Rebazak good point. But what if there could be a car with plenty of muscle that also had a very respectable power to weight? Almost like an all-in-one?
All-in-one? Something that has bolt-on, take-off features, space, weight, and horsepower? Really I don’t get all the complaints about how heavy the Camaro is. I like the road handling of the ‘heavy’ Camaro for what it is. As far as plenty of muscle with better power-to-weight – isn’t that the Vett and its Caddy cousin?
A good power to weight ratio is wonderful BUT with it, you must have a buttoned down suspension, no good to have a tossable chassis if its not cooperating with the driver…however, the question is; power or power to weight , assuming good suspension, I’d much rather have a small lightweight car with BIG, BIG power…seriously… with reasonable (300HP) power than a bigger, heavier one with 600HP. Nice big brakes on both please !
I presently have a C6 Corvette and am patiently waiting for the new (2014), hopefully lighter and (just as) powerful C7 ! (better interior please !) I also have an ’08 HHR “SS” which I love ! Except for its balkly Saab 5sp manual it is the North American VW GTI which is, my opinion, the best vehicle in its class.
I hope the 2.0 litre turbo Ecotec motor (with about 300HP) shows up in the new Malibu and the new (H.O.) Cruze. Come on GM ! Mopar is gonna make a 300HP Chrysler 200 “Super S”, Ford has the new Focus ST and has brought back the Taurus SHO. The 2.0 Ecotec turbo can be the new small block ! Don’t let car nuts down !!
Jim Hamilton – Canadian Speedfreak !
Love the way this question is written, especially the seafood dinner part – brought a smile to my face. You guys keep it up.
Now, I’d rather have something like the 130 R. A compact RWD with about 250-300 horses. Plenty quick and tossable.
Power to weight. Power to weight. Power to weight. Power to weight.. Cannot say that enough. I would rather a decent handling (can i get a thicker steering wheel on my Cruze please?) fairly quick vehicle that still doesnt cost me an arm and a leg at the pump than an all out power mobile. Power is great if you can use it. Most people can’t and won’t use all that power. When was the last time you saw a “Please feel free to legally go your cars top speed on this road” speed limit sign?
I still have a soft spot for a Pontiac G8 GXP though.
power to weight should actually be th biggest mesurment for comparison i mean the atom had a four banger but could hang with some v12s because it weighed about as much as a small dog
i want the code 130 r. have the 2.5 as the base motor but have an optional upgrade to a 300hp v6. weight at 3000 but no more than that. give it a full line up, coupe, sedan, convertible and wagon.
We call can agree the right choice is balance. Show me a Shelby Cobra and I’ll show you the advantages of stuffing a huge lump into a feathery light sports car.
Today when each car is legislated to posess a large amount of safety equipment, it’s incredible engineers can still squeeze record amounts of quickness, agility and speed out of a car weighing in at 4,000 lbs. and above. Conundrums abound – as to how light can we get lithium battery packs and if we pass a certain point, the fruits as in speed will shame even a 1,000 hp racebred car. Tesla roadster’s powerplant contained two moving parts and was the size of a watermelon! 3.9 sec to 60 is nothing to poke at.
If you get a chance there’s a documentary circulating on Discovery networks re: the death days of Formula 1 racing. I was too young at the time to realize that it was a regular occurance in the fifties, sixties and seventies for one or two drivers to lose their lives in a single race! These cars were fast – but with nearly zero safety features, some drivers didn’t even wear seatbelts! Morality , driver’s unions and common sense pressure finally made race car manufacturers and race circuit promoters own up to the death toll and build safety in as a top priority. Much thanks to Jackie Stewart.
Bottom line: It makes zero sense that a car is lightning quick if you don’t survive the trip!
Another point on the above. Colin Chapmen, revered as the father of Lotus racing glory was obsessed by weight. When his engineers would come to him with a design he would berate them as junk if they could not pare off another few pounds. Thusly he lost some of his best drivers – Jim Clark, and Jochan Rindt for two. Later in life he was desponded upon the losses his obsession with weight reduction in racecars produced in human lives. It got to the point where he would not get close to his drivers because he felt it was only a matter of time before they were gone.
So at what point is speed the deciding factor as to what makes a great automobile? I feel driver control and electronic systems to keep a car planted properly and on the road are immensley important. Case-in-point: Danica Patrick. She caused ire in Indy racing due to her weight. Male drivers sometimes exceed her weight by 60-90 lbs. Engineers would kill to take that much weight off of a racecar! But she didn’t win. The only Indy race she won was in Japan on gas mileage strategy by her crew cheif! I don’t expect big things from her in NASCAR either. There is much to be said about car control and skill – and this transfers to electronic and mechanical devices that insure a car handles the speed input a driver gives it in all situations.
Power-to-weight is an incredibly important dynamic – yet it’s moot unless other capabilities of the car are baked in.
Power to Weight seems to be the logical choice. I’ve driven a friends Cooper S that had a few mods to it. I was quick, high revving, and was fun to sling through the corners…However….
This past weekend, I took my ’72 Grand Prix to a car show. It’s about 4200lbs, 494 cubic inches, 620HP, 730 ft-lb of Torque. (It also has 4-wheel disks, sway bar front and rear, and some wide sticky meats at all four corners) When you launch that car, it is an awesome feeling when that heavy front end rises up, and the exhaust note just exudes power! On the way back from the show, I found a spot clear of traffic and wound it out to 140MPH. Having that much power in a large car is simply a different experience. That bigger power provides a sensory overload that a smaller, lighter car with similar performance doesn’t quite match. (Oh and yes, I got about 10MPG)
For a bit of both worlds, my father hand built a car around a 400 pontiac motor/700R4 trans. It’s about 40inches tall, has a 100″ wheelbase, weighs around 2200lbs – with around 400HP. It’s barely street-legal and the tiny spartan interior is not made for the claustrophic. It’s stable at speed and very well balanced in the corners, but the power to weight ratio is so skewed, that it can be downright scary.
Just thought I’d throw in my 2 cents…
Ah yes, and then we enter the Buick Grand National… Here is a heavy car – and yet lighter than a big bore V-8. Show me even modern cars that can stay with a Grand National in the 1/4 mile.
Tricked out G/Ns or 2nd stage G/Ns with the IndyLights V-6 turbo are downright scarey fast – 9s in the 1/4 mile. Turbo Regals from the era as well – probably the world’s #1 sleeper. A turbo Regal from back in the day looked like grandpa’s sedan but would blow Corvette’s away like leaves from a leaf blower!
Power-to-Weight – oh the challenges. Look at the few cars over 1000 hp today. They can top 200, even a couple cars ( Veyron, SSC Aero, Koenigsegg ) reach over 250. At what cost to mileage? Think about solid fuel rocket boosters – they go thousands of miles per hour but use enough fuel to power an entire city.
At last, dilemma solved, LOL!
http://gmauthority.com/blog/2012/11/this-tuned-chevrolet-spark-packs-a-70l-ls7-v8-corvette-z06-engine/